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re: Could Saban win a national championship at South Carolina?
Posted on 11/20/13 at 7:56 am to Crimson Legend
Posted on 11/20/13 at 7:56 am to Crimson Legend
The only SEC schools where Saban couldn't win a natty are:
Ole Miss
Mississippi State
Kentucky
Mizzou
Vanderbilt
Ole Miss
Mississippi State
Kentucky
Mizzou
Vanderbilt
0
Posted on 11/20/13 at 7:58 am to Wrenchruh
He might be able to now after what he's done at LSU and Bama and also since Spurrier has us in the position he does. If Spurrier was a workaholic we may be even better but he is not. We have to accept that and be glad we have him. I think Spurrier may be the top dog at understanding and reading defenses during a game but his teams fall short in different areas of preparedness.
Posted on 11/20/13 at 8:13 am to Crimson Legend
Maybe but the Bama job is the perfect storm for Saban. Big stadium, they had just spent $100m on facilities, created an excellent achademic center, big time fan base that put 90k in the stands on Spring Game, and long time tradition that creates a base to build on.
Not sure USC has all that but I guess could get there.
Not sure USC has all that but I guess could get there.
Posted on 11/20/13 at 8:16 am to Crimson Legend
He'd be pulling in LA, Bama and Carolina recruits,
His dynasty would be unmatched.
His dynasty would be unmatched.
Posted on 11/20/13 at 8:19 am to Crimson Legend
Because Saban recruits at such a high level, people forget that he's also coached up 3 stars into 1st round material. I'm at work, so I'm not going to waste the time to look through all our past recruiting classes, but I know off the top of my head that Chance Warmack was just an under-the-radar 3 start recruit that was molded into a Top 15 pick.
Posted on 11/20/13 at 8:19 am to Wrenchruh
quote:
Not without the built in advantages of coaching at Bama.
Saban's ability to evaluate and accumulate talent has been vastly exaggerated. The reason his recruiting classes rank so high is because of the "Bama Bump"
that recruits get by the services when signed by Saban. The REC has infilitrated the services in order to give the appearance that Alabama has more talent than it
actually does. This helps with preseason rankings and gives them the benefit of the doubt over other non conference teams in the BCS standings. Do you think that USCe gets the benefit of the doubt that Alabama got in 2011 and 2012? Of course not. But if their talent on paper looks better, they might.
At USCe, CNS would not have the refs in his pocket like he does at Bama, nor would he have the scheduling advantages.
One only has to look at the NFL to see the fraud he has built at Bama. When the offensive line is allowed to hold at will, they create giant holes for their running backs to run through. The talent of these backs, and all of Bama's players really, are vastly overrated due to playing weak opponents and having the ref's on their side. This is why all of Saban's players are busts in the NFL.
There is no way that CNS could win a national title at South Carolina.
This is correct.
Do not leave out the fact that USCe's network of handlers, bag-men, and private tutors is probably nowhere near as expansive as Alabama's. They've spent decades spinning that web.
Posted on 11/20/13 at 8:37 am to Schwaaz
quote:
Maybe but the Bama job is the perfect storm for Saban. Big stadium, they had just spent $100m on facilities, created an excellent achademic center, big time fan base that put 90k in the stands on Spring Game, and long time tradition that creates a base to build on.
Not sure USC has all that but I guess could get there.
USC has all of this except tradition.
I was having this exact same conversation with a UTK fan friend of mine.
IMO, Spurrier has done more here than Saban would have if both had started in 2005. Spurrier likes to build programs from relative scratch, while everything was in place at Alabama for Saban to win immediately. Spurrier had to have an AD willing to invest in facilities and infrastructure, and some of those investments are starting to pay dividends.
We've always had the fan support, but most of our fans didn't really know how far behind the rest of the conference we lagged when it came to extras such as weight rooms, video boards, stadium experience, academic centers, etc. In the last 10 years, USC's campus looks radically different from how it did Holtz's last season here.
Now that Spurrier has built USC into a consistent top-10 threat, a guy like Saban could finish the drill. But he would not have been able, I don't think, to build here the foundation that Spurrier and Hyman did. USC is now an attractive job for the next coach (who I still believe is currently on staff). We couldn't say that after Holtz, and certainly not after Brad Scott.
Posted on 11/20/13 at 8:39 am to Crimson Legend
I like to think yes. We are attracting above average talent already, and the boost Saban would give us would put us over the edge. If by some miracle, Saban leaves bama and heads down the road to Cola, I will be happier than a camel on wednesday.
The clemson tears alone would be worth it.
The clemson tears alone would be worth it.
Posted on 11/20/13 at 8:41 am to RoyalAir
quote:
(who I still believe is currently on staff).
curious, who do you think this is, because I would rather see us go outside hire.
Posted on 11/20/13 at 8:54 am to Crimson Legend
Yes
Posted on 11/20/13 at 8:55 am to atlgamecockman
quote:
curious, who do you think this is, because I would rather see us go outside hire.
I think it's Shawn Elliott's job to lose. I do not pretend to have any kind of inside info/look at the program, but he's young, a great recruiter, the architect of our successful ground game, and he's from Camden. Plus, he's got the demeanor. Just a hunch, but I would be surprised if he isn't seriously considered.
scrooster has some inside info with the program. What are your thoughts?
Posted on 11/20/13 at 8:56 am to Crimson Legend
Saban can win anywhere in the SEC at this point based entirely on his coaching ability and his reputation.
Posted on 11/20/13 at 9:03 am to Bench McElroy
quote:
Yes. South Carolina is a much better program than LSU was when Saban took over in 2000 and he turned them into a powerhouse and national champion. There's no reason why he can't do the same at South Carolina.
That aside, LA was a much more fertile recruiting area that spread into East Texas with no legitimate in state rival while USCe always has to compete with perennial powers in Clemson and UGA. Florida and Tennessee also pull their share of recruits in the Carolinas.
Posted on 11/20/13 at 9:04 am to RoyalAir
quote:
Shawn Elliott
I really like the man and what he has done here for sure. However, I don't think his experience so far would translate well to a HC position. For that matter, neither would Whammy's or GA's.
Whammy is awesome, great recruiter, great D coordinator, can't see him as the HC.
GA is great with recruiting, really amazing talent there, and does pretty well coaching up the QB's (if we use connor's progression from last year to this year as evidence)
Elliott is a great coach, can light a fire under players, and has been a major part of our success on the recruiting trail and in the running game.
Having said all that, they are all unproven at the HC spot. I would rather see someone with experience than someone unproven at the top of the food chain. I think all 3 may get some consideration, but in the end, it will be an outside hire.
EDIT: I have no insider info either btw
This post was edited on 11/20/13 at 9:05 am
Posted on 11/20/13 at 9:04 am to Quicksilver
quote:
Saban can win anywhere in the SEC at this point based entirely on his coaching ability and his reputation.
I think this is close to accurate. If Saban had come to South Carolina after the Dolphins, could he have done it in 5-6 years? Not sure. Let's be honest, the Saban of MSU/LSU days was a high tier coach, but he wasn't some unstoppable force like he is perceived now. But when he went to Bama it was just such a huge story that his ability combined with the credibility provided by the media attention turned him into a machine.
Saban is half ability/half reputation. That isn't a slight, that is how it is in college coaching. But without the mega story of him going to Bama and what has followed since (which includes the ease of recruiting to Bama), I don't think he gets that level of talent into USC that quickly.
Posted on 11/20/13 at 9:06 am to Pettifogger
quote:
I don't think he gets that level of talent into USC that quickly.
I think the talent would follow him to some extent. Not from Bama, but you can bet the house that every high school football player in america who is serious about playing in college knows who Saban is and what he is capable of.
Posted on 11/20/13 at 9:12 am to Crimson Legend
I don't know.
Saban has only won National Championships at programs that have won them before and with programs with more historic football success than SC has had.
His system recruits really well, it's a solid process, but it's added by catch phrases like, "come help us win our 16th National Championship," or "do you see all these rings?"
How much energy would Saban have left after he left Bama though? Would he just be looking for a place with good food, women and golf to spend his twilight years?
SC's next HC in 4-8 years is going to need to be a guy who's gone somewhere that hasn't had a lot of success prior and built that program into a National Title contender.
Saban has only won National Championships at programs that have won them before and with programs with more historic football success than SC has had.
His system recruits really well, it's a solid process, but it's added by catch phrases like, "come help us win our 16th National Championship," or "do you see all these rings?"
How much energy would Saban have left after he left Bama though? Would he just be looking for a place with good food, women and golf to spend his twilight years?
SC's next HC in 4-8 years is going to need to be a guy who's gone somewhere that hasn't had a lot of success prior and built that program into a National Title contender.
Posted on 11/20/13 at 9:14 am to Crimson Legend
He'd dominate the SEC EastPosted on 11/20/13 at 9:15 am to atlgamecockman
quote:
I think the talent would follow him to some extent. Not from Bama, but you can bet the house that every high school football player in america who is serious about playing in college knows who Saban is and what he is capable of.
Now yes. My point was that when Saban came to Bama, the media (probably unjustifiably to some extent) started talking about him like he was simply unbeatable. Of course, he is now, after years of using Bama's reputation and the media's help, but at the time, coming from MSU/LSU/Miami, he hadn't really shown that. He'd shown himself to be a championship caliber coach, but there are plenty of those. The drama of the move to Bama and the media attention that followed paid huge dividends to Saban.
So if he'd gone to USC instead, I don't think the same thing would have happened. He would certainly get talent, but USC doesn't have the Bama-factor, nor would Saban have as much Saban-factor becoming the head coach of USC.
I think if he went from Bama to USC today under favorable circumstances, the recruiting would follow and there would be a pretty good chance he could get it done in 5 years.
Posted on 11/20/13 at 9:16 am to Crimson Legend
Absolutely.
The Nick Saban brand speaks for itself these days. Any program that he chooses to go to has instant credibility and will be able to recruit. If you get great players, you'll typically succeed. It's no coincidence that Bama consistently finishes #1 in the recruiting rankings and wins bigger than everyone else.
The Nick Saban brand speaks for itself these days. Any program that he chooses to go to has instant credibility and will be able to recruit. If you get great players, you'll typically succeed. It's no coincidence that Bama consistently finishes #1 in the recruiting rankings and wins bigger than everyone else.
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