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re: WIll we ever be a team that recruits top talent?
Posted on 9/9/14 at 2:55 pm to Koch Snowflake
Posted on 9/9/14 at 2:55 pm to Koch Snowflake
I agree. Talent is bred, taught and nutured. Recruiting services would be more accurate if they gave star ratings for their "list of measurables."
They can't accurately rate talent as there are too many variables, so just list the measurables and rate kids as they stack to the list. That way we can recognize just how useless it really is.
They can't accurately rate talent as there are too many variables, so just list the measurables and rate kids as they stack to the list. That way we can recognize just how useless it really is.
1
Posted on 9/10/14 at 6:13 pm to ford1911
quote:
My concern isn't really about present day. Coach Pinkel has proven himself imo with his recruiting philosophy. Although I wouldn't mind still getting in more top recruits. I'm not trying to knock the talent we have either, and I also understand the rating system used by recruiting sites is often flawed. But top talent is top talent. My concern is the future. What happens when Coach decides to hang it up? We need to improve our options. Improve the amount of talent we are able to bring in. It's going to be tough to recruit with Bama, Auburn, Lsu, A&M, Georgia, Florida and Tennessee on a consistent basis. My goal is to be a consistent 8th or 9th best recruiting team in the SEC and on good years 5th - 7th. I don't think that is unrealistic.
We probably will never out recruit those you've listed. That would be a monumental task. Keeping top quality instate recruits is where it's at. There is some good talent right here in this state and it gets better every year.
I think Pinkel has a proven evaluation process he sticks to. It as well as their development of players has produced some good NFL talent. I don't see the need to recruit "top talent" as it doesn't guarantee you anything. If you recruited according to "top talent" assuming you're referring to player ratings, you're putting your eggs in someone else's basket. You're pinning your success on someone else's evaluation of talent. You still have to rely on your coaches evaluations. So if you still have to evaluate players, why rely on what outsiders opinions of those players are. We as fans look at Rivals and other sites as it's our only look and evaluation of talent of players. So the picture for us gets skewed because we don't really see what the coaches see in a player and how that player "fits" a program or doesn't fit a program. Just because they are sitting there with 5*'s, doesn't always mean they are the best fit.
This post was edited on 9/10/14 at 6:14 pm
Posted on 9/10/14 at 6:53 pm to jafo
Solid post. I agree with the instate talent. GP has been good at this in the past but ironically, since the move to the SEC we've struggled. Roderick Johnson. Ezekiel Elliott. Brian Wallace. Hale Hentges. Alex Ofodile. All instate guys I'm sure the staff would have loved to have landed. Having said that, I'm happy with who the staff went out and got when they missed on these guys.
As for top talent, I would love to see what the staff could do with the top talent. And I mean those guys that the staff identifies and offers early that also happen to be highly rated by the services. Probably 90% of the guys shown with offers for 2016 are 4 and 5* guys. The staff does a great job with who they bring in when they miss on those guys, but I'd really love to see what they could do if they landed more of them.
As for top talent, I would love to see what the staff could do with the top talent. And I mean those guys that the staff identifies and offers early that also happen to be highly rated by the services. Probably 90% of the guys shown with offers for 2016 are 4 and 5* guys. The staff does a great job with who they bring in when they miss on those guys, but I'd really love to see what they could do if they landed more of them.
Posted on 9/10/14 at 10:21 pm to reedus23
What you want to know is if MU will ever recruit kids that ratings services say are good...
The longer MU stays in the SEC, the more this question becomes moot. Mizzou recruits good players that fit Pinkel's system. For lack of a better phrase, call them 'program players'. Recruiting services cater to the readers of their magazines. Accordingly, ratings tend to be skewed.
The State of Missouri produces good in state talent as do surrounding states. Kids want to play for SEC teams. Mizzou is well positioned to reap this benefit.
Big cash inflow, means SEC arms race. Bigger, better facilities especially contrasted to that of Mizzou's former conference mates or those of the B1G.
Good coaches, good strength and conditioning program, innovative schemes, and good program players equals winning seasons. That is Mizzou's formula for success.
Better players will come. SEC equals big man football.
The longer MU stays in the SEC, the more this question becomes moot. Mizzou recruits good players that fit Pinkel's system. For lack of a better phrase, call them 'program players'. Recruiting services cater to the readers of their magazines. Accordingly, ratings tend to be skewed.
The State of Missouri produces good in state talent as do surrounding states. Kids want to play for SEC teams. Mizzou is well positioned to reap this benefit.
Big cash inflow, means SEC arms race. Bigger, better facilities especially contrasted to that of Mizzou's former conference mates or those of the B1G.
Good coaches, good strength and conditioning program, innovative schemes, and good program players equals winning seasons. That is Mizzou's formula for success.
Better players will come. SEC equals big man football.
Posted on 9/10/14 at 10:49 pm to ozland
quote:
Good coaches, good strength and conditioning program, innovative schemes, and good program players equals winning seasons. That is Mizzou's formula for success.
I agree with you on this but don't kid yourself, GP and staff want the same kids everyone else wants. Just look at our 2016 offer list already. They just do a pretty damn good job when we don't get them. They get kids they can mold and turn into football players.
Posted on 9/10/14 at 11:13 pm to reedus23
quote:
reedus23
WIll we ever be a team that recruits top talent?
Solid post. I agree with the instate talent. GP has been good at this in the past but ironically, since the move to the SEC we've struggled. Roderick Johnson. Ezekiel Elliott. Brian Wallace. Hale Hentges. Alex Ofodile. All instate guys I'm sure the staff would have loved to have landed. Having said that, I'm happy with who the staff went out and got when they missed on these guys.
As for top talent, I would love to see what the staff could do with the top talent. And I mean those guys that the staff identifies and offers early that also happen to be highly rated by the services. Probably 90% of the guys shown with offers for 2016 are 4 and 5* guys. The staff does a great job with who they bring in when they miss on those guys, but I'd really love to see what they could do if they landed more of them.
I agree. There seems to be a common cop out saying we do great with 3 star recruits and the recruiting services are faulty. They may be, but we offer a lot of those 4 and 5 star players but don't get a lot to commit. Obviously we wish we could have had them.
We need to be better at this to beat Bama in the championship one day. If Saban gets 50-75% of the 5 star guys he offers, he will continue to rule the league in championships and recruiting class. GP could win the national championship if were in Saban's shoes. Saban just makes his path easier by getting the best players to coach up.
This post was edited on 9/10/14 at 11:15 pm
Posted on 9/10/14 at 11:24 pm to pauliebleaker
Current offers per 247 for 2016:
4*
4*
4*
4*
4*
3 1/2*
4 1/2*
3*
4*
4*
3 1/2*
3 1/2*
NR
4 1/2*
3*
4*
3 1/2*
Yes, GP uses his own system, but even his system ends up in the same place as the services more times than not. At least with the guys they like enough to offer early. Hope it's not coming off as me complaining because I'm thrilled with where the program is but I really think enough of this staff and what they do that if they could just get a handful more of these early targets, they might make a real run at the ultimate trophy.
4*
4*
4*
4*
4*
3 1/2*
4 1/2*
3*
4*
4*
3 1/2*
3 1/2*
NR
4 1/2*
3*
4*
3 1/2*
Yes, GP uses his own system, but even his system ends up in the same place as the services more times than not. At least with the guys they like enough to offer early. Hope it's not coming off as me complaining because I'm thrilled with where the program is but I really think enough of this staff and what they do that if they could just get a handful more of these early targets, they might make a real run at the ultimate trophy.
This post was edited on 9/10/14 at 11:25 pm
Posted on 9/11/14 at 6:30 am to ford1911
Mizzou recruits talent every year, whether some scout that has seen the kid play a couple times in high school rates him high is another story. I think Pinkel is on the money, you can teach a kid to play football, you can't teach a kid to be 6'4" and run a 4.4 40.
Posted on 9/11/14 at 7:50 am to surgicalvenom
Aldon Smith says hello
Posted on 9/11/14 at 8:09 pm to reedus23
As long as Pinkel keeps having winning seasons in the SEC, then I think they will land some of those "top Quality" recruits. I still don't think they will equal the big 5 or 6 schools in the SEC.
Those instate recruits you listed. Most had some strange things surrounding their recruiting. Some odd happenings. All Mizzou can do is try.
It would be interesting to see a Mizzou squad full of 4 and 5 star talent. It also be nice to see what Mizzou could do with a good defensive coordinator. Steck, likes to play like he has 4 and 5 star recruits on defense. Freakin 3-4 scheme. That SECCG still chaps my arse.
Those instate recruits you listed. Most had some strange things surrounding their recruiting. Some odd happenings. All Mizzou can do is try.
It would be interesting to see a Mizzou squad full of 4 and 5 star talent. It also be nice to see what Mizzou could do with a good defensive coordinator. Steck, likes to play like he has 4 and 5 star recruits on defense. Freakin 3-4 scheme. That SECCG still chaps my arse.
Posted on 9/11/14 at 8:33 pm to jafo
quote:
That SECCG still chaps my arse
You too? I
I feel the same. 
Posted on 9/11/14 at 8:34 pm to reedus23
quote:
I agree with you on this but don't kid yourself, GP and staff want the same kids everyone else wants. Just look at our 2016 offer list already. They just do a pretty damn good job when we don't get them. They get kids they can mold and turn into football players.
This.
Posted on 9/11/14 at 9:54 pm to jafo
Nevermind. It is not worth causing problems. Carry on.
This post was edited on 9/11/14 at 10:22 pm
Posted on 9/12/14 at 6:34 pm to Tigersessed
quote:
Nevermind. It is not worth causing problems. Carry on.
By all means, elaborate. What problems? It's just opinions.
Posted on 9/12/14 at 7:54 pm to jafo
You are entitled to opinions, but it is a fact that Mizzou never played a 3-4 in the SECCG. Nor have they played a 3-4 this year. The problem is I said something about for constructive criticism to work, you need to understand what you are criticizing. That is why I edited.
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