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re: New system president to be named next week.
Posted on 10/18/16 at 8:10 pm to Zou brownmajic
Posted on 10/18/16 at 8:10 pm to Zou brownmajic
Make no mistake CS1950 is a threat to free speech. This is from a New York Times article today on the very topic of Millenial college students desiring to shut down speech they disagree with with a quote from one of he CS1950 founders:
"And yet, what’s apparent in terms of the report and the publicity about it is that the report has made very little headway towards common ground. Why? Because these student activists really aren’t looking for common ground at all. Floyd Abrams, a very famous First Amendment and free speech advocate, a man well recognized as a defender of free speech throughout successive generations, says that there not only is not real common ground in this report, but that the authors of the report in describing the problem don’t seem to have read their own words. The issues are even larger than they admit, the internal contradictions of this moment, especially as made clear within this student generation. This was made very clear by the reporter in citing a student at the University of Missouri by the name of Storm Ervin. She’s a cofounder of the group known as Concerned Student 1950. That group made a lot of headlines in terms of the very flashpoint nature of the race controversy on that campus over the last couple of years. She said, “Free speech is the reason we were allowed to protest.”
But notice how she turns around almost immediately. The reporter says that,
“Ms. Ervin, like many fellow students, does not see untrammeled free expression as always the paramount value, or one that is easily reconciled with equality and inclusion.”
In other words, she’s certain that free speech is a basic human right for herself and for her group, but when it comes to a group that might disagree on some basic issue, well then it appears she’s not so committed to free expression or to free speech after all. The University Missouri student said that the campus, “…is not a psychological safe space for all, and part of the reason is that of free speech.”
If you follow her statement, it’s clear that she sees free speech as an asset until it’s not; then it becomes a liability. I think the group PEN America is absolutely right that this is a problem, but I agree with Floyd Abrams. It’s a problem a lot bigger than they are admitting in this report."
LINK
"And yet, what’s apparent in terms of the report and the publicity about it is that the report has made very little headway towards common ground. Why? Because these student activists really aren’t looking for common ground at all. Floyd Abrams, a very famous First Amendment and free speech advocate, a man well recognized as a defender of free speech throughout successive generations, says that there not only is not real common ground in this report, but that the authors of the report in describing the problem don’t seem to have read their own words. The issues are even larger than they admit, the internal contradictions of this moment, especially as made clear within this student generation. This was made very clear by the reporter in citing a student at the University of Missouri by the name of Storm Ervin. She’s a cofounder of the group known as Concerned Student 1950. That group made a lot of headlines in terms of the very flashpoint nature of the race controversy on that campus over the last couple of years. She said, “Free speech is the reason we were allowed to protest.”
But notice how she turns around almost immediately. The reporter says that,
“Ms. Ervin, like many fellow students, does not see untrammeled free expression as always the paramount value, or one that is easily reconciled with equality and inclusion.”
In other words, she’s certain that free speech is a basic human right for herself and for her group, but when it comes to a group that might disagree on some basic issue, well then it appears she’s not so committed to free expression or to free speech after all. The University Missouri student said that the campus, “…is not a psychological safe space for all, and part of the reason is that of free speech.”
If you follow her statement, it’s clear that she sees free speech as an asset until it’s not; then it becomes a liability. I think the group PEN America is absolutely right that this is a problem, but I agree with Floyd Abrams. It’s a problem a lot bigger than they are admitting in this report."
LINK
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Posted on 10/18/16 at 8:18 pm to Stir of Echoes
quote:
One only needs to go to TB and read some of the stuff being said about J'Mon to see that Majics point of view is valid here.
I respect surgicalvenom's points. I think there's validity to the view that there were racial issues and at a bare minimum a perception of a problem. And there's obviously a contingent of our fanbase that has racial issues. The Kim Anderson/Frank Haith dichotomy displays that clearly enough. I'm not going to pretend we don't have issues.
Majic's points are largely bullshite. And I'm not going to sacrifice reason to pretend to agree with them.
Posted on 10/18/16 at 8:48 pm to the808bass
I didn't intend for this thread to be about racism at Mizzou. I will share some of the stuff I have learned from other staffers at Mizzou. The issue was known about by Loftin. Loftin was on his way out the door by Mizzou for other issues he had caused on campus. To stick it to Wolfe, he let this stuff grow out of hand not meet with the protesters immediately. By the time Wolfe was aware of the situation it was out of hand. By that I mean that the talking stages had passed. Wolfe didn't help his case by ignoring them. Campus had a huge break down in communication and that reflects leadership. In many many ways what happened was horrible but a small silver lining is that Mizzou has a chance to get leadership that the university needs to move forward. It is a top 30 university but could be so much more.
Posted on 10/18/16 at 9:12 pm to surgicalvenom
quote:and there is the issue. there final list of 'demands'
That was the meeting after the protest group was formed. Take a step back a few weeks when Wolfe refused to even schedule a meeting. That's actually how he became the enemy. He wouldn't even acknowledge that they had concerns.
were partially fine and a lot silly. Posted on 10/18/16 at 9:20 pm to the808bass
quote:and yet that is how this started. from the n word. You want to blame 20 year old protesters for the complete lack of competence the administration handled this with
This is exactly the issue. People who create false dichotomies where there's either safe spaces of people yelling the n word.
quote:and this is where we wind up over and over with you. Your most intelligent argument is to call someone stupid. So let's use your standard of discourse. It is a shame your mother didn't have access to legal abortion services after she had that unnatural liaison with a donkey in tijuana cause then I wouldn't have to put up with your implicit racist bullshite.
It's a fricking stupid game and therefore exactly what I'd expect from you - a fricking idiot.
Posted on 10/18/16 at 10:23 pm to JesusQuintana
quote:
Wolffe could have ended this before it ever started
I still can't understand why people think it is the system President's job to schedule meetings with individual students after being called names.
That has NEVER been a system president's responsibility.
It is ridiculous to expect the University to individually address system-wide every instance of hurt feelings (regardless of how heinous it may be). End of story.
This post was edited on 10/18/16 at 10:28 pm
Posted on 10/18/16 at 10:37 pm to the808bass
quote:
Majic's points are largely bullshite. And I'm not going to sacrifice reason to pretend to agree with them.
I'm not going to begrudge him his opinion. Some have gone on record here saying they would never send their kids there because of how the administration didn't quash the protests quietly. He says he wouldn't send his kid there because of what he perceives as racial tension. I don't see much difference in either stance, just polar opposites of each other and I don't begrudge either for their view.
Posted on 10/19/16 at 6:19 am to reedus23
Well since this thread has gone the way it's gone and to catch everyone up on all of the actual racist incidents that happened, can someone post them?
Posted on 10/19/16 at 7:25 am to JAGsports
quote:
The issue was known about by Loftin. Loftin was on his way out the door by Mizzou for other issues he had caused on campus. To stick it to Wolfe, he let this stuff grow out of hand not meet with the protesters immediately.
Loftin was an unmitigated disaster. He was front and center in the middle of the racial stuff and hired Mack Rhoades. I don't think he could have sabotaged our AD worse if he had purposefully set out to do so.
Posted on 10/19/16 at 7:26 am to reedus23
quote:
I'm not going to begrudge him his opinion. Some have gone on record here saying they would never send their kids there because of how the administration didn't quash the protests quietly. He says he wouldn't send his kid there because of what he perceives as racial tension.
I don't mind his opinions. He's welcome to them. He's not welcome to his own set of facts.
Posted on 10/19/16 at 7:28 am to MIZ_COU
quote:
and yet that is how this started. from the n word. You want to blame 20 year old protesters for the complete lack of competence the administration handled this with
And the protesters wanted to blame the school for the actions of a townie. There's plenty of dumb to go around.
You conflate the entire issue to a some random CoMoer saying the n word. The "safe space" argument isn't just about racial epithets. You dumbing it down to that doesn't change it.
quote:
implicit racist bull shite.
No one is scared of some lily white liberal pussy empowered to yell "racist" by his "Theories of Race Constructs" class 20 years ago. GFY
This post was edited on 10/19/16 at 7:32 am
Posted on 10/19/16 at 1:54 pm to the808bass
Rumors are that it is Rod McDavis...outgoing Ohio University (bobcats, not ohio state) President. Would be horrible hire.
Leaving aside his skin color (which should have absolutely nothing to do with the hire, but likely will be considered)...he is all the negative aspects of Loftin without the prior credentials of research.
His only achievements (if we can call them that) are minority-related and HBU centric.
If he is hired, I would consider that a sure sign of flushing down the drain any hopes of regaining our status.
Leaving aside his skin color (which should have absolutely nothing to do with the hire, but likely will be considered)...he is all the negative aspects of Loftin without the prior credentials of research.
His only achievements (if we can call them that) are minority-related and HBU centric.
If he is hired, I would consider that a sure sign of flushing down the drain any hopes of regaining our status.
Posted on 10/19/16 at 2:45 pm to 5thTiger
5th Tiger is spot-on.
If he's hired, we'll know exactly why he's hired.
If he's hired, we'll know exactly why he's hired.
Posted on 10/19/16 at 3:46 pm to Literalist
Seems pretty wualified to me.
University is in a tough spot. Hire a white guy and they hired him because he's white. Hire a black guy and they hired him because he's black.
Whoever it is. Keep your head down. Do your job and don't make any news.
University is in a tough spot. Hire a white guy and they hired him because he's white. Hire a black guy and they hired him because he's black.
Whoever it is. Keep your head down. Do your job and don't make any news.
Posted on 10/19/16 at 4:50 pm to 5thTiger
quote:
s only achievements (if we can call them that) are minority-related and HBU centric.
Weird. I didn't see an HBU on his job history.
Posted on 10/20/16 at 12:38 am to the808bass
His crowning achievement as an admin is creating the Interlink Alliance, which connected Ohio University to traditionally HBUs, for the sake of diversity. Ohio University has slid drastically during his tenure particularly in the rankings, and that is indisputable.
At least with Loftin I can say there was a history of research and focus in those areas (even if he sucked at it in my estimation). McDavis has multiple votes of no confidence at Ohio University. I'm not making shite up for the fun of it. I care about our university.
At least with Loftin I can say there was a history of research and focus in those areas (even if he sucked at it in my estimation). McDavis has multiple votes of no confidence at Ohio University. I'm not making shite up for the fun of it. I care about our university.
This post was edited on 10/20/16 at 12:51 am
Posted on 10/20/16 at 6:59 am to Zou brownmajic
quote:
I love the Missouri Tigers, but with me being African American I would never allow my kids or grand kids to accept a scholly to play ball at Mizzou because of the right-winged radical and extremist reactions to last years boycott. When people tell me that I don't have the right to stand up for what I believe in and I'm not doing it in a violent way the heck with them. Dr. King was called a trouble maker for protesting and boycotting in a peaceful and effective way.
Incorrect on several accounts, troll.
Posted on 10/20/16 at 6:02 pm to JAGsports
Tod Palmer told me that Ohio University prez name has been kicked around as well as an AT&T executive
Posted on 10/20/16 at 6:14 pm to JAGsports
jose gutierrez Is another name
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