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Posted on 2/25/13 at 6:43 pm to Sigma_Dawg6
lolz. yep. you need two ends like Clowney, and a big,strong DT.
Posted on 2/25/13 at 6:51 pm to 11Will44
Posted on 2/25/13 at 6:51 pm to 11Will44
3-4 defense is the most versatile.
You can use 3 downlinemen and pinch to the inside allowing the linebackers to fly to the ball.
Or you can walk up 2 linebackers (any of them because they are generally very athletic) and have a 5 man front to help fill the gaps. Essentially using the same personnel to appear 5-2.
You can use 3 downlinemen and pinch to the inside allowing the linebackers to fly to the ball.
Or you can walk up 2 linebackers (any of them because they are generally very athletic) and have a 5 man front to help fill the gaps. Essentially using the same personnel to appear 5-2.
Posted on 2/25/13 at 7:10 pm to meansonny
This is very true. It can also be disguised as 4-3 or even 4-2-5. Plus, you kinda need a front seven to have a defense in the SEC.
Posted on 2/25/13 at 7:20 pm to 11Will44
It depends what you mean by versatile. If by versatile you mean being able to bring different types of blitz packages and vary your fronts, then the 3-4 probably is. But if by versatile you mean being able to match up against multiple personnel groups, then probably either a 3-3-5 or 4-2-5.
Keep in mind that most teams that run a base 3-4 or 4-3 end up swapping up to nickle and dime packages when more than 2 WRs come into the game. While Bama runs a base 3-4, they play nickle (which for Bama is usually the 4-2-5) the majority of the time because teams use 3 & 4 WR sets so often. The last thing you want to do is get a LB matched up against a WR with today's athletes.
Keep in mind that most teams that run a base 3-4 or 4-3 end up swapping up to nickle and dime packages when more than 2 WRs come into the game. While Bama runs a base 3-4, they play nickle (which for Bama is usually the 4-2-5) the majority of the time because teams use 3 & 4 WR sets so often. The last thing you want to do is get a LB matched up against a WR with today's athletes.
This post was edited on 2/25/13 at 7:28 pm
Posted on 2/25/13 at 7:27 pm to Bamatab
quote:
It depends what you mean by versatile. If by versatile you mean being able to bring different types of blitz packages, then the 3-4 probably is. But if by versatile you mean being able to match up against multiple personnel groups, then probably either a 3-3-5 or 4-2-5.
Keep in mind that most teams that run a base 3-4 or 4-3 end up swapping up to nickle and dime packages when more than 2 WRs come into the game. While Bama runs a base 3-4, they play nickle (which for Bama is usually the 4-2-5) the majority of the time because teams use 3 & 4 WR sets so often. The last thing you want to do is get a LB matched up against a WR with today's athletes.
Good point. But the converse holds true.
How many teams that have a nickel defense when there is no fullback or a tight end is split out wide stay in that defense when there is a fullback and/or tight end.
Posted on 2/25/13 at 7:28 pm to meansonny
Linebackers are the most versatile players.
The more linebackers you have on your squad, the more versatile you will be.
The more linebackers you have on your squad, the more versatile you will be.
Posted on 2/25/13 at 7:38 pm to meansonny
quote:
Good point. But the converse holds true.
How many teams that have a nickel defense when there is no fullback or a tight end is split out wide stay in that defense when there is a fullback and/or tight end.
Teams that run a true 3-3-5 or 4-2-5 defense as their base defense usually stay in those defenses even when the offense is in a 2 WR personnel grouping (hence the base defense). But they usually have a safety that is big and/or a good tackler that they can move up to a LB spot (teams used to call it a rover position).
Posted on 2/25/13 at 7:40 pm to 11Will44
4-2-5..
Posted on 2/25/13 at 7:43 pm to gateway2mizzou01
6-2-3
Posted on 2/25/13 at 7:48 pm to 11Will44
4-2-5 would get slaughtered by a true power run team.
Posted on 2/25/13 at 7:54 pm to 11Will44
I'm a huge fan of the 4-2-5. This scheme really demands some athleticism on the inside or else a dual-threat quarterback can open up the playbook and have you on your toes.
For example...
Good : 2011 Iron Bowl
We were able to shut down Auburn (at least in the first half...sigh) because we had guys like Dareus and Hightower on the inside who posed problems for Cam. To be fair, we lost that game because of sloppy pass coverage not because of inside play.
Bad : 2012 vs Texas A&M
I hate to rag on any Alabama defense but it's clear that we didn't have the raw athleticism and speed on the inside to contain JFF. This opened up the playbook for Sumlin and gave him the edge in play-calling for most of the game. All it takes is a couple of long runs by the QB to have the inside playing on their toes. This makes it really hard for the defense because it's hard to commit to pass coverage or contain when you have a guy like Manziel who is a threat with both his feet and his arm.
Tl;DR If I had to pick a defense with the perfect personnel for the respective scheme, then I would have to say 4-2-5 is the most versatile.
For example...
Good : 2011 Iron Bowl
We were able to shut down Auburn (at least in the first half...sigh) because we had guys like Dareus and Hightower on the inside who posed problems for Cam. To be fair, we lost that game because of sloppy pass coverage not because of inside play.
Bad : 2012 vs Texas A&M
I hate to rag on any Alabama defense but it's clear that we didn't have the raw athleticism and speed on the inside to contain JFF. This opened up the playbook for Sumlin and gave him the edge in play-calling for most of the game. All it takes is a couple of long runs by the QB to have the inside playing on their toes. This makes it really hard for the defense because it's hard to commit to pass coverage or contain when you have a guy like Manziel who is a threat with both his feet and his arm.
Tl;DR If I had to pick a defense with the perfect personnel for the respective scheme, then I would have to say 4-2-5 is the most versatile.
Posted on 2/25/13 at 7:57 pm to 11Will44
quote:
3-3-5 is good all around against the pass. but a good run game will make it ineffective.
You've been playing too many video games.
Posted on 2/25/13 at 7:59 pm to trickydick12
quote:
4-2-5 would get slaughtered by a true power run team.
No doubt. That is why the really good defensive minds run multiple defensive sets depending on the personnel packages. They will run either a 3-4 or 4-3 against running formations, and then switch to nickle and/or dime packages against passing formations.
Posted on 2/25/13 at 8:02 pm to 11Will44
IMO the 4-2-5 is the most versatile....IMO you can more easily transition from that to a traditional 4-3-4 or 3-3-5 depending on down situations. We moved to the 4-2-5 to better defend against spread offenses, and with the proper personnel fits it supposedly enables adjustments on the field without having to switch out personnel between plays as often, which is good against no-huddle offenses or hurry-up offenses....
Posted on 2/25/13 at 8:02 pm to 11Will44
3-4 is probably the best for the college game because the quarterbacks are typically not talented enough to make all the throws, particularly the deep fade route. In our 3-4, the first focus is stopping the run. The Dline is not so much focused on sacking the QB as they are controlling space and closing down running lanes. The LBs are therefore the ones that are going to make a lot of the plays since they handle the underneath stuff and attack the ball carrier. Because of the size of our front 7, the safeties often are not as greatly needed to help stop the run (not saying they don't do it anyway, just that it isn't a requirement). Therefore, the safeties can focus on taking away the middle of the field which is where many high percentage passes are thrown. This leaves the deep fade route as the most accessible route, but it is also one of the ones with the lowest completion percentage. Fortunately, our corners are typically fast and talented enough to make this route even more difficult to stop by forcing the QB to throw into a tiny window. Most college QBs cannot do this, so they can't really get much going in the passing game. In the NFL, the QBs are much more accurate, so defense in general is much more difficult.
ETA: Going against a Heisman trophy caliber QB throws everything out the window.
ETA: Going against a Heisman trophy caliber QB throws everything out the window.
This post was edited on 2/25/13 at 8:04 pm
Posted on 2/25/13 at 8:06 pm to trickydick12
quote:
4-2-5 would get slaughtered by a true power run team.
I agree. The only way a 4-2-5 would stand a chance against this type of offense (which is sadly becoming an anomaly in the modern day CFB scene)would be to have a physical safety that almost has a linebacker presence on the field. This is a rarity though. You see players like Mark Barron who play this role and usually end up getting burnt because of their hesitance to play pass or run.
Posted on 2/25/13 at 8:17 pm to 11Will44
LSU Defense
Posted on 2/25/13 at 8:39 pm to UAFanFromNOLA
quote:
3-4 is probably the best for the college game because the quarterbacks are typically not talented enough to make all the throws, particularly the deep fade route. In our 3-4, the first focus is stopping the run. The Dline is not so much focused on sacking the QB as they are controlling space and closing down running lanes. The LBs are therefore the ones that are going to make a lot of the plays since they handle the underneath stuff and attack the ball carrier. Because of the size of our front 7, the safeties often are not as greatly needed to help stop the run (not saying they don't do it anyway, just that it isn't a requirement). Therefore, the safeties can focus on taking away the middle of the field which is where many high percentage passes are thrown. This leaves the deep fade route as the most accessible route, but it is also one of the ones with the lowest completion percentage. Fortunately, our corners are typically fast and talented enough to make this route even more difficult to stop by forcing the QB to throw into a tiny window. Most college QBs cannot do this, so they can't really get much going in the passing game. In the NFL, the QBs are much more accurate, so defense in general is much more difficult. ETA: Going against a Heisman trophy caliber QB throws everything out the window.
Mark Barron was the second leading tackler on your team in 2011 and leading tackler in 2010. The safety is huge in run support in the 3-4 defense. I'm not sure what team you are a fan of.
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