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Posted on 9/24/14 at 10:00 pm to five_fivesix
They should just make killing people illegal.
Posted on 9/24/14 at 10:48 pm to CNB
Yes, yes they should.
Posted on 9/24/14 at 11:17 pm to CNB
No no no, if you make murder illegal then you turn honest murderers into criminals.
Posted on 9/24/14 at 11:19 pm to Stonehog
Stonehog strikes again
Posted on 9/24/14 at 11:29 pm to Alahunter
Did the gun perform CPR or something?
Or did it lead to the clerk starting a gun fight?
Or did it lead to the clerk starting a gun fight?
Posted on 9/25/14 at 9:23 am to Rebelgator
quote:
It's ironic that our liberal gun ownership laws were intended to prevent government's bullying of citizens. Instead, we must protect ourselves from fellow citizens who want what we have and seek to take it by force.
I don't think this is what the Founders had in mind.
The Founders were human men like all of us and whatever the hell they intended in 1787 is a nice guideline but by no means sacrosanct. Time change, needs change.
quote:
How is it illogical to say on this case that the gun saved a life? That it killed others is irrelevant.
Unbelievable. Truly. I nearly went cross-eyed reading this.
quote:
No, because if the law abiding citizen didn't (clerk) wasn't allowed to have a gun to protect himself, he would probably have been shot and the criminals might have gotten away with it.
Thanks to legal gun ownership, the bad guys lost and good guy won.
You know what also protects people? Bulletproof glass. Let's suppose he had that, rather than a gun: he wouldn't be in the hospital, two other people wouldn't be dead, and he wouldn't have put (potential) bystanders at risk by engaging in a firefight.
There are no good guys and bad guys in this scenario (from the info provided). The article linked is woefully devoid of information, which isn't much of a surprise given the source and the agenda.
quote:
You are being disingenuous.
Yeah, I read a thread title that says "Guns Save Lives" and click on it expecting to see people saved from death rather than ending up dead and in the hospital, yet I'm being disingenuous. And you have the nerve to label people "illogical?" Wake up, dummy. 
Posted on 9/25/14 at 9:32 am to WheelRoute
The clerk could have just given up the money, file a police report, then get the insurance money. I assume there's an insurance for this type of situation. No one dies in this situation.
Posted on 9/25/14 at 9:32 am to WheelRoute
quote:
There are no good guys and bad guys in this scenario (from the info provided).
Posted on 9/25/14 at 9:39 am to DownSouthJukin
quote:
DownSouthJukin
If this clerk opened fire on the robbers after they'd already robbed him and were leaving he's a moron and deserving of scorn.
Like I said, there isn't much info in the source.
Posted on 9/25/14 at 9:44 am to WheelRoute
If you want to see gun advocates squirm just ask them what their stance is on nuclear proliferation.
This post was edited on 9/25/14 at 9:45 am
Posted on 9/25/14 at 9:48 am to WheelRoute
Why would that make someone that believes in Constitutional Rights squirm?
Posted on 9/25/14 at 9:59 am to Alahunter
quote:
Why would that make someone that believes in Constitutional Rights squirm?
It won't if the only argument a gun advocate is using is the constitutional rights argument.
Posted on 9/25/14 at 9:59 am to WheelRoute
quote:
If this clerk opened fire on the robbers after they'd already robbed him and were leaving he's a moron and deserving of scorn.
Wrong. He was just cleaning out the garbage. Your inability to grasp the stark difference between right and wrong in this situation is a microcosm of what's wrong with a large part of our society today: relativism. As for your post on nuclear proliferation, that's apples and oranges to this discussion.
One of the many reasons the Founders included the 2nd Amendment was so that we could protect ourselves from persons such as you should persons such as you ever enter into power and become tyrannical and unleash the unlawful mobs on the citizens. This is being done slowly and surreptitiously by the implementation of laws that would prevent us from protecting ourselves in our own homes and businesses, and impeding lawful gun ownership, thus making the criminals the rights holders, and making the law abiding citizens the criminals.
The hard-working individual in this article was being robbed by lawless thugs. Whether they were facing him or walking off is irrelevant to the discussion of whether or not what he did was ultimately wrong or right. These pieces of filth walked in somewhere with a gun, knew the risk if brandishing it, and paid for it.
This post was edited on 9/25/14 at 10:01 am
Posted on 9/25/14 at 10:07 am to DownSouthJukin
quote:
Your inability to grasp the stark difference between right and wrong in this situation
There is very little information to make such a determination and, regardless, we have a judicial system set up to make those decisions. If you want to delegate the duties of judge/jury/executioner to every citizen then OK, everyone is entitled to their opinion. It just seems kinda silly for someone who so ardently wants to subvert the Constitution to be invoking it in their very next paragraph, though.
Posted on 9/25/14 at 10:08 am to WheelRoute
Then I reckon one can assume you're disappointed that you won't make anyone squirm.
Posted on 9/25/14 at 10:17 am to Alahunter
quote:
Then I reckon one can assume you're disappointed that you won't make anyone squirm.
The idea that we will all be safer if everyone has guns is not a constitutional argument.
Posted on 9/25/14 at 10:19 am to WheelRoute
Correct. It's a byproduct of having that Constitutional Right to own and possess them.
Posted on 9/25/14 at 10:26 am to Alahunter
quote:
Correct. It's a byproduct of having that Constitutional Right to own and possess them.
It's a byproduct, in a sense. It's actually a policy argument (and, thus, not a legal one). And bringing up nuclear proliferation is a way to analogize w/ the intent to clarify the argument: if we apply this sort of thinking to other current issues, would we think the same way?
Analogies aren't perfect. But they are useful in helping expand someone's understanding of an issue. They help a person see their own argument from a different angle.
This post was edited on 9/25/14 at 10:27 am
Posted on 9/25/14 at 10:27 am to WheelRoute
The problem with everybody having guns is that it makes people too quick to use that lethal option, imo.
This clerk may have not needed to start a gun fight, but he had the means and fear makes people do irrational things. It's much the same that drives our trigger happy cops to pop dogs and unarmed perps. They think they may be in danger and have lethal means of fighting back, the facts of their actual danger be damned.
It's human nature.
This clerk may have not needed to start a gun fight, but he had the means and fear makes people do irrational things. It's much the same that drives our trigger happy cops to pop dogs and unarmed perps. They think they may be in danger and have lethal means of fighting back, the facts of their actual danger be damned.
It's human nature.
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