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re: Common Core Math
Posted on 5/16/14 at 9:32 am to BluegrassBelle
Posted on 5/16/14 at 9:32 am to BluegrassBelle
Common Core is an unmitigated disaster and is a disservice to teachers, parents and students alike. What a cluster
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Posted on 5/16/14 at 9:38 am to Duke
And that would be ok if teacher's jobs weren't based upon academic growth in a year for a student. As you said, it may make them better at math down the road (I'm not a math major so I'll take your word on that). But their teachers and administrators are not being judged on down the road. They're being judged on right now, as are the students.
Basically the DoE implemented a system at the same time they're expecting substantial educational growth in students despite teachers AND students having to learn the new system. The standardized testing based on the common core is also significantly harder then anything they've implemented before, but there's no leeway to account for that.
And like I said, Math isn't the only core subject with issues in the Common Core. They're also pushing out anything that isn't reading, math, science, or social studies. About the only good thing I can get behind with CC is the new emphasis on language mechanics at an early age.
Basically the DoE implemented a system at the same time they're expecting substantial educational growth in students despite teachers AND students having to learn the new system. The standardized testing based on the common core is also significantly harder then anything they've implemented before, but there's no leeway to account for that.
And like I said, Math isn't the only core subject with issues in the Common Core. They're also pushing out anything that isn't reading, math, science, or social studies. About the only good thing I can get behind with CC is the new emphasis on language mechanics at an early age.
Posted on 5/16/14 at 9:42 am to BluegrassBelle
Coupled with merit based pay it was doomed to failure from the beginning. Then it was introduced and people realized how shitty the material was.
Posted on 5/16/14 at 9:46 am to BluegrassBelle
quote:
Basically the DoE implemented a system at the same time they're expecting substantial educational growth in students despite teachers AND students having to learn the new system. The standardized testing based on the common core is also significantly harder then anything they've implemented before, but there's no leeway to account for that.
quote:
And that would be ok if teacher's jobs weren't based upon academic growth in a year for a student.
That's a problem with the system in general. A mind numbingly frustrating stupid aspect of the system. Benchmarks for the sake of them and then basing teacher raises or their jobs over those arbitrary bemchmarks...
I'm sure you could rant on this more than myself, but the problem is still the system. If I were a teacher or a parent, I'd be pretty pissed off at it all too. I just argue common core isn't the problem, merely it is adding more pressure to an already fundamentally flawed view and approach to education.
Posted on 5/16/14 at 9:48 am to BluegrassBelle
quote:
it makes it increasingly difficult when you have to deal with educating the parent along with the child in order for the child to get help outside of school hours.
This. I had to figure out the new way of problem solving(especially division) and it seemed like they were going around the block to go next door with some of their methods.
Posted on 5/16/14 at 9:51 am to Duke
quote:
I see some value in the different methods. Gets kids accustomed to theory earlier. However, it looks confusing as frick to someone who never did it.
Why teach kids theory when they don't even understand the facts? It flies in the face of how we learn. I'm biased, but Classical Education is a much sounder basis for learning. Grammar, logic, rhetoric.
Teachers hate drill and practice. So what? You don't like drill and practice? Teach college philosophy. It's elementary school math. You're gonna have to drill and practice.
Posted on 5/16/14 at 9:53 am to BluegrassBelle
quote:
They're also pushing out anything that isn't reading, math,
Fify.
quote:
And that would be ok if teacher's jobs weren't based upon academic growth in a year for a student.
This seems a bit hyperbolic.
Posted on 5/16/14 at 9:57 am to the808bass
quote:
Why teach kids theory when they don't even understand the facts?
They have to get some basis of the facts before the theory matters. The theory in this case is more braking down different ways to approach number properties. That's what I've gotten from reading the problems. That's really useful when you get to the real theory and abstraction down the road. I'll grant you need to know 3x9=27 before you can start breaking that down to more useful shortcuts and properties.
There's got to be drill and pratice. It's math. It's the same for a 1st grader learning addition as an engineering student in differential equations as a math major getting into the nitty gritty of algebraic theory. Pratice, pratice, pratcie.
Posted on 5/16/14 at 10:04 am to the808bass
quote:
This seems a bit hyperbolic.
Due to state audits on schools not meeting benchmarks, schools in my area had the option of either shutting down (the extreme when our district is growing), restaffing 50% of staff (which doesn't really work when you're doing it every three years), or adopting the transformation model where teacher's pay/jobs are based upon closing academic gaps and the academic growth of the students in their classroom by year. You can meet your benchmark scores but you have to ALSO show academic growth per student and per category (i.e. Gender, race, special education, ESL, etc).
If just one of those groups don't meet their academic growth benchmark then it doesn't matter if all the other groups did and you met your overall scores.
As Duke said, completely flawed based on the utopian notion that every student has the same academic threshold. Common core just heightens that for everyone (even though I still don't care much for it).
Posted on 5/16/14 at 10:04 am to CatFan81
the old fashioned way sux needs to be reformed.
Calculators should NEVER be allowed for a math class first and foremost. They are only useful for cheating.
Calculators should NEVER be allowed for a math class first and foremost. They are only useful for cheating.
Posted on 5/16/14 at 10:08 am to CheeseburgerEddie
quote:
Calculators should NEVER be allowed for a math class first and foremost. They are only useful for cheating.
I can't think of a time I used them for anything other than a trig function in degrees or getting a decimal approximation of a log or exponential since 8th grade.
Posted on 5/16/14 at 10:22 am to BluegrassBelle
quote:
Due to state audits on schools not meeting benchmarks, schools in my area had the option of either shutting down
This isn't because of common core. And I think common core will, in the end, reduce the pressure on those "underperforming schools." (Trust me on this. :) )
And yes, it's a utopian idea to say every kid can be proficient. But I think educators who are in schools where 70% of the kids aren't proficient should probably shut up about standards and hope no one notices they're doing a really shitty job with what they've got.
ETA:
quote:
If just one of those groups don't meet their academic growth benchmark then it doesn't matter if all the other groups did and you met your overall scores.
This is a bit fuzzy. Some of wife's school's score went down last year but they still made their yearly goal. So it's not just that every single score and subgroup has to go up every year.
This post was edited on 5/16/14 at 10:25 am
Posted on 5/16/14 at 10:31 am to the808bass
quote:Fromm my understanding of CC Math, the facts aren't important. They would rather a child understand the theory and process as opposed to getting the right answer.
Why teach kids theory when they don't even understand the facts? It flies in the face of how we learn. I'm biased, but Classical Education is a much sounder basis for learning. Grammar, logic, rhetoric.
Basically they are saying "explain to me how to solve 2x4. You think it equals 7, that's ok as long as you can document the process for how you got there."
Posted on 5/16/14 at 10:35 am to PJinAtl
quote:
Fromm my understanding of CC Math, the facts aren't important. They would rather a child understand the theory and process as opposed to getting the right answer.
Yes. And that's the opposite of how kids actually learn. IMO, of course.
Posted on 5/16/14 at 10:39 am to DirtyDawg
Link wont load, can someone cut paste please
Posted on 5/16/14 at 10:46 am to the808bass
I don't know anything about common core specifically.
But students tend to focus on problems as opposed to methods. Which is terribly wrong. My entire math career I probably worked two of each type of problem before each test, maybe three for the final.
You write out a sheet of what you learned by going through the book. The equations, rules, methods and different twists and then work through the study guide or 1 of each type of problem using your formulas, etc. which you write down.
Then you read back through the work and you say to yourself "if the problem had said this instead I would have done this, this and this to get the answer". You don't have to work it out because all that shite is just the basic algebra/calculus whatever which you should already know. Then read through again a couple times and work through another set of problems without the aid of the sheet. Read through some more to be sure you understand anything you missed the second time around and you are good to go.
TL, DR version: I think teaching kids to focus on methods instead of problems at an early age is a good thing in the long run and not just for math, but for almost all education.
But students tend to focus on problems as opposed to methods. Which is terribly wrong. My entire math career I probably worked two of each type of problem before each test, maybe three for the final.
You write out a sheet of what you learned by going through the book. The equations, rules, methods and different twists and then work through the study guide or 1 of each type of problem using your formulas, etc. which you write down.
Then you read back through the work and you say to yourself "if the problem had said this instead I would have done this, this and this to get the answer". You don't have to work it out because all that shite is just the basic algebra/calculus whatever which you should already know. Then read through again a couple times and work through another set of problems without the aid of the sheet. Read through some more to be sure you understand anything you missed the second time around and you are good to go.
TL, DR version: I think teaching kids to focus on methods instead of problems at an early age is a good thing in the long run and not just for math, but for almost all education.
Posted on 5/16/14 at 10:46 am to CheeseburgerEddie
quote:
TL, DR version: I think teaching kids to focus on methods instead of problems at an early age is a good thing in the long run and not just for math, but for almost all education.
Except it's not how we learn. Other than that, it's a great theory.
Posted on 5/16/14 at 10:49 am to the808bass
Everyone learns differently, it is exactly how I learned.
Kids should be taught how to learn better. It is possible. Or we can stick to the same old learn you multiplication tables which in the end don't help us with anything at all.
In an anecdotal note, which you can certainly choose to disregard. Many of the students I helped very much appreciated my process of focusing on the methods and found that they understood what they were learning a whole lot better.
Kids should be taught how to learn better. It is possible. Or we can stick to the same old learn you multiplication tables which in the end don't help us with anything at all.
In an anecdotal note, which you can certainly choose to disregard. Many of the students I helped very much appreciated my process of focusing on the methods and found that they understood what they were learning a whole lot better.
This post was edited on 5/16/14 at 10:51 am
Posted on 5/16/14 at 10:53 am to DanMullins4Life
Merlins, go entertain yourself in some other way. Or at least with someone else.
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