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Spread Offense vs. Pro Style Offense
Posted on 11/14/12 at 10:44 pm
Posted on 11/14/12 at 10:44 pm
After watching A/M torch Bama in the 1st QTR last week and continue to see teams like Oregon in the hunt for the title every year - does it make sense not to run a spread offense?
Exciting Games = Yes
Chance to win Every Game = Yes (see Ole Miss improvement)
Advantage over Defense w/ Hurry Up = Just ask Saban
Doesn't hurt Defense - see Chizik's theory FAIL
AU - Please hire Gus Malzahn quickly (guarantee 8 wins even with a sorry QB)
Great QB + Great D Coordinator= Nat'l Title Run every year
I just hope UA and LSU stay in the Pro Style and don't go pay for one of these up and coming Coordinators that act like Kelly, Sumlin, Malzahn. Could you imagine UA or LSU with a Spread NHHU Offense? Geeze that would be scary. Thank goodness for Ego's
Exciting Games = Yes
Chance to win Every Game = Yes (see Ole Miss improvement)
Advantage over Defense w/ Hurry Up = Just ask Saban
Doesn't hurt Defense - see Chizik's theory FAIL
AU - Please hire Gus Malzahn quickly (guarantee 8 wins even with a sorry QB)
Great QB + Great D Coordinator= Nat'l Title Run every year
I just hope UA and LSU stay in the Pro Style and don't go pay for one of these up and coming Coordinators that act like Kelly, Sumlin, Malzahn. Could you imagine UA or LSU with a Spread NHHU Offense? Geeze that would be scary. Thank goodness for Ego's
Posted on 11/14/12 at 10:48 pm to AUX3
Bama got torched in the 1st quarter against A+M because they came out flat with no emotion. Had Bama decided to play the 1st quarter A+M wouldn't have scored 3 TDs.
Posted on 11/14/12 at 10:49 pm to AUX3
quote:
Doesn't hurt Defense
Highly disagree.
quote:
AU - Please hire Gus Malzahn quickly
I do believe he would be the best hire for AU.
Posted on 11/14/12 at 10:51 pm to AUX3
Defense and running the ball still wins Championships. Au won the NC because of defense and running the ball.
Posted on 11/14/12 at 10:58 pm to AUX3
quote:Zeke Pike, Kiehl Frazier, Tyrik Rollison, and Clint Moseley all say hello. I'd rather not have Malzahn.
AU - Please hire Gus Malzahn quickly (guarantee 8 wins even with a sorry QB) Great QB + Great D Coordinator= Nat'l Title Run every year
Posted on 11/14/12 at 11:06 pm to AUX3
quote:
Doesn't hurt Defense
yeah, gonna have to disagree with that
your offense having drives that last 2:00 minutes compared an opposing pro style team with 6-8 min. drives would eventually catch up with your defense and they would tire out and lose a game late.
That was Bama's biggest problem in the TAMU game, not controlling time of possession. Sure TAMU ran all up and down the field on them in the 1st quarter, but if Bama puts together at least 1 sustained drive in the 1st quarter, that's a completely different game. Bama couldn't get off the field on 3rd down for the majority of the LSU and TAMU games and it cost them.
Also to the point of a spread offense vs a great D-line. One of the biggest reasons Oregon struggled in the 2010 BCSNCG is because they had no answer for moving the ball inside of 10 yard line. Sure Cam Newton got auburn to the game, but the d-line that year wone them the NC.
Bottom line. Defense wins championships.
Posted on 11/14/12 at 11:15 pm to AUX3
I wouldn't consider what LSU does to be pro style/west coast. I'd probably call it The Pangea.
This post was edited on 11/14/12 at 11:16 pm
Posted on 11/14/12 at 11:53 pm to AUX3
Ill say this every time this question is brought up; The talent available is far superior to the scheme you run.
Sure, scheme can help take advantage of mismatches, but without talent you will not consistently win.
Our offense is good and is fun to watch, but I think we would have similar results if we ran a ground and pound or a more pro style set. We have the OL, RBs, QBs, and WRs to run anything and be successful.
So run whatever, just have the horses necessary. I will also say this about defense. Our offense has yet to hinder our defense. We have forced a lot of 3 and outs because we have a good defense. If your defense or offense sucks, they are going to defend a lot of snaps regardless because your defense cant stop em and your offense cant drive.
Sure, scheme can help take advantage of mismatches, but without talent you will not consistently win.
Our offense is good and is fun to watch, but I think we would have similar results if we ran a ground and pound or a more pro style set. We have the OL, RBs, QBs, and WRs to run anything and be successful.
So run whatever, just have the horses necessary. I will also say this about defense. Our offense has yet to hinder our defense. We have forced a lot of 3 and outs because we have a good defense. If your defense or offense sucks, they are going to defend a lot of snaps regardless because your defense cant stop em and your offense cant drive.
Posted on 11/15/12 at 12:06 am to AUX3
I'm sorry I can't get into 70-63 games like WVU and TT played. And Bama lost because of two turnovers inside the aTm ten not anything to do with aTm's offense.
Posted on 11/15/12 at 12:07 am to AUX3
It's the hurry up no huddle that A&M ran on Alabama. The spread is a formation. Many teams operate from the spread even Alabama, just not as much as some.
Alabama runs a multiple offense. When in 2 minute, they can spread the field and run no huddle.
Some teams spread it out all the time and hardly use a TE.
Urban ran the zone read at UF most of the time.
The Pro Style can spread the field very easily, so to call them different offenses is not quite correct.
Alabama runs a multiple offense. When in 2 minute, they can spread the field and run no huddle.
Some teams spread it out all the time and hardly use a TE.
Urban ran the zone read at UF most of the time.
The Pro Style can spread the field very easily, so to call them different offenses is not quite correct.
Posted on 11/15/12 at 12:09 am to AUX3
system is irrelevant as long as the coach is a good teacher and the kids being coached are good athletes.
Posted on 11/15/12 at 2:37 am to AUX3
Pro Style > Spread
And it's not even fricking close.
Look at the most consistent LONG TERM teams.
Teams like UGA, Texas and LSU (although a little too pass happy) are the most consistent teams in CFB. Why? Because they run a more pro-style offense.
Teams like Florida, Auburn and Oregon run the spread successfully for a few years until the defense figures it out and dominates them. Why do you think Urban retired? Health reasons?
The spread is garbage if you want to consistently be successful. If you want to jump from team to team and be smoke and mirrors, it could work as well. As soon as the Pac-12 teams figure that shite out that Oregon does, it will be a wrap. As for OSU? shite... Urban will be retiring again in no time.
Posted on 11/15/12 at 6:43 am to AUX3
I've watched several QB's run the spread being a Mizzou fan and have seen two different OC's versions. I have to say, with the right players, the spread can be fun to watch. It's a quik strike style offense. But you can also play ball control and run with the offense also. It all hinges on the QB play. You have to have a true dual threat QB to make it work. The big downside to the spread is the defense being on the field more. You better have good depth on defense.
Conventional offense is more balanced. Between the run and pass and is more of a ball control offense but still can have quick strike capability depending where you are on the field. It also allows the defense a chance to catch it's breath, allowing a team to not be required to have as much depth on the defensive side of the ball.
I think it's easier to contain a conventional offense compaired to a spread just for the ball control run first pass second mantality. But there is always exceptions to the rule. I think a true spread offense is a more potent offense with the correct players in place being they are looking to hit paydirt from the first snap of the ball no matter the field position.
Either way, to me, it does'nt matter. Both are effective ways to score points but just different theories on how to do it. It think the spread has the bigger downside with the defense being left on the field alot. This becomes magnified if you run into a well balanced attack.
Conventional offense is more balanced. Between the run and pass and is more of a ball control offense but still can have quick strike capability depending where you are on the field. It also allows the defense a chance to catch it's breath, allowing a team to not be required to have as much depth on the defensive side of the ball.
I think it's easier to contain a conventional offense compaired to a spread just for the ball control run first pass second mantality. But there is always exceptions to the rule. I think a true spread offense is a more potent offense with the correct players in place being they are looking to hit paydirt from the first snap of the ball no matter the field position.
Either way, to me, it does'nt matter. Both are effective ways to score points but just different theories on how to do it. It think the spread has the bigger downside with the defense being left on the field alot. This becomes magnified if you run into a well balanced attack.
Posted on 11/15/12 at 6:45 am to AUX3
Spread offenses depend on very smart and disciplined players as to how successful they will be. aTm's admission standards, if I am correct, are higher than most SEC schools. GaTech made it work because they are Tech. That being said, the Aggies offense can't be copied at most other schools here
And an up tempo spread can't be run by the level of thug that AU generally recruits
And an up tempo spread can't be run by the level of thug that AU generally recruits
This post was edited on 11/15/12 at 7:27 am
Posted on 11/15/12 at 7:59 am to AUX3
If one of the plethora of SEC teams that could be looking for a new coach doesn't hire Sonny Dykes you all deserve what you get.
I hope no one else goes to the spread, hurry-up, or whatever you want to call it because it would be good for us.
I hope no one else goes to the spread, hurry-up, or whatever you want to call it because it would be good for us.
Posted on 11/15/12 at 8:18 am to AUX3
It has been garbage for us in the redzone the last few weeks. Cost us the vandy game...
Posted on 11/15/12 at 8:37 am to AUX3
The hurry up is definitely effective but I'm not really a fan. I felt this way even before A&M ate Bama's lunch.
It's just a matter of preference but I'd rather watch an old school battle of wits between coordinators than to watch an offense try to run plays too fast for the defense to make adjustments or substitute.
I saw yesterday where A&M fans were calling out LSU for faking injuries in order to stop the clock. Personally, I don't see the problem with that. Both teams were manipulating the clock to their own benefit.
It's just a matter of preference but I'd rather watch an old school battle of wits between coordinators than to watch an offense try to run plays too fast for the defense to make adjustments or substitute.
I saw yesterday where A&M fans were calling out LSU for faking injuries in order to stop the clock. Personally, I don't see the problem with that. Both teams were manipulating the clock to their own benefit.
Posted on 11/15/12 at 6:37 pm to AUX3
A lot of folks don't understand the concepts at all. I'm no X's and O's guru, but what ate Bama's lunch as much as anything was tempo, not scheme. You can run a hurry up, no huddle attack using a Pro-style, West Coast offense--A&M did for the preceding four years under Mike Sherman. Heck, we might even have run the offense faster under Sherman than we have so far under Sumlin. So, whehter you're using a West Coast offense and power blocking schemes, or a spread attack with more zone blocking schemes, the pace really takes away Saban's personnel advantage, and is a great equalizer.
A&M is running Mike Leach and Hal Mumme's old Air Raid, only, as someone else pointed out, they're doing it with future NFL guys on the OL, and with a QB who is a rushing threat, a combination I don't think you've ever seen with this offense. Kingsbury really just started figuring out how to use all the weapons properly with the Auburn game. It's not a sophisticated offense--they don't even have a playbook. They just depend on out executing the other team, and outlasting them. If Sumlin can recruit NFL prospects on the oline and defense (and I see no reason why he can't), I think A&M will have plenty of success running this scheme. The main differnce will be that we won't turn out a QB who is quite so ready to run an NFL West Coast offense as Ryan Tannehill has been.
Bama counts on having the numbers to have fresh kids, that are more talented than the guys they are going against, line up against a fatigued opponent. Not much strategy or intellect involved with that.
A&M is running Mike Leach and Hal Mumme's old Air Raid, only, as someone else pointed out, they're doing it with future NFL guys on the OL, and with a QB who is a rushing threat, a combination I don't think you've ever seen with this offense. Kingsbury really just started figuring out how to use all the weapons properly with the Auburn game. It's not a sophisticated offense--they don't even have a playbook. They just depend on out executing the other team, and outlasting them. If Sumlin can recruit NFL prospects on the oline and defense (and I see no reason why he can't), I think A&M will have plenty of success running this scheme. The main differnce will be that we won't turn out a QB who is quite so ready to run an NFL West Coast offense as Ryan Tannehill has been.
Bama counts on having the numbers to have fresh kids, that are more talented than the guys they are going against, line up against a fatigued opponent. Not much strategy or intellect involved with that.
Posted on 11/15/12 at 6:40 pm to AUX3
Out of the top 10 teams in the current BCS standings, seven of those teams have pro-style offenses. Last year, seven out of the top 10 teams in the final AP poll ran pro-style offenses. A pro-style offense is still the most effective style for team success.
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