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re: Something that needs to be said about football
Posted on 7/4/23 at 9:00 pm to WonderWartHawg
Posted on 7/4/23 at 9:00 pm to WonderWartHawg
I can see Arkansas becoming another Wisconsin or Virginia Tech.
If they hire consistently good coaches that can develop players and are above average game day decision makers.
If they hire consistently good coaches that can develop players and are above average game day decision makers.
2
Posted on 7/4/23 at 9:03 pm to dchog
I just want to stay good at basketball and baseball where we can win a natty.
Football is whatever for me 7-5 8-4 type program no shot at a natty sport.
I hope we don't fall off in baseball when DVH retires.
Football is whatever for me 7-5 8-4 type program no shot at a natty sport.
I hope we don't fall off in baseball when DVH retires.
This post was edited on 7/4/23 at 9:04 pm
Posted on 7/4/23 at 9:35 pm to hawgfaninc
quote:Bars
Fans such as yourself that say Pittman is Bert 2.0 see vague similarities and because you want more success yesterday, saying Pittman is Bert 2.0 is a lazy oversimplification to excuse your impatience.
Posted on 7/4/23 at 9:49 pm to Hawgnsincebirth55
quote:
Jeff long, John L smith, Bret Bielema, and chad Morris.
Alright. That's three football coaches in a row, and the fourth one isn't exactly killing it right now. The issue here is trajectory. Football has been trending in a way that's uncomfortably homogenous and stale. The disparity between the top ten or so teams and everyone else is staggering to the point of boring, rather than impressive. With every rule and procedural change, college football has painted itself into a corner. How many dud coaches in a row does it take before this is just us? Since 1990, we've had eight football coaches. By the standards of Ken Hatfield and prior, one of those seven were actually good. Four were terrible, and three have been mediocre. The problem is one of those mediocre coaches won a national championship at Clemson, but couldn't beat 8 wins here. One of the terrible ones had great success at Wisconsin. At what point is it us?
There's a damn near 35-year trend going on, here.
quote:
Before John L smith our worst football season ever was when we went 4-6 way back in the day and that was the only time we’d only won 4 games, until John L.
What the frick are you talking about? Houston Nutt went 4–7 "way back when" - a whole seven years prior. And Jack Crowe wen 3–8 in 1990.
quote:
Then bert beat that prestigous record twice, his first and last year’s respectively, by only winning 3 games.
No, he went 4–8 his final year, not 3–9. How is that season not burned into your brain?
quote:
sam hasn’t had a 3-9 season yet. Bert had 2. And as bad as the liberty loss was, I think Rutgers and Toledo were worse. Liberty was about on par with Texas tech for me.
Again, no he hasn't, but Liberty is considered a G5 team. Losing to an 8–5 team playing a mostly G5 schedule is absolutely worse than losing to Texas Tech. They played seven G5 teams, plus an FCS team (which they beat by one point), plus BYU. It's especially bad considering Liberty lost the next four in a row after beating us - with their third string quarterback. Did you forget that, too? They were on their #3 QB and beat us. In Fayetteville. Not even War Memorial. And you want to say that Liberty team was secretly good because they beat up on some weak competition and snuck into the rankings? That loss is unforgivable.
Posted on 7/4/23 at 9:53 pm to BallHawg10
quote:
Everybody got mad at me last year for saying this but I still am waiting to see how Sam is any different than Bielema. I’m no Bielema apologist but it definitely feels like throwing him in with Morris is just a coping mechanism
In his second year, he beat Bielema's best record accrued in five tries. And the program was definitely worse off when Pittman took charge. He's honestly more like Houston Nutt, except he doesn't embarrass us every time he opens his fricking mouth, and he's not secretly a snake in the grass hiding behind a yuck-yuck good ol' boy facade. But the results are looking to be the same so far. He's at least out-trending Bielema in every category.
Posted on 7/4/23 at 9:55 pm to UltimateHog
Arkansas football now is a 6 win program. An 8-4 yearly average puts Arkansas on the level of Iowa between Hayden Fry and Nick Ferentz that produced 15 nine plus seasons and five conference titles.
Posted on 7/4/23 at 10:03 pm to Riggle
quote:
It's hard for me to be too critical of Sam because he brought us back from the abyss and gave the program stability. The job is unquestionably in a better spot than when we fired Chad
I really do like Sam Pittman. All things considered, he might be my favorite Hog coach since I became sentient enough to watch football. My gripe is more with the AD and boosters seeming hellbent on sabotaging the bread-and-butter sport of the South. We're an SEC program. Everything about us screams that we're serious about football - except the coaching hires. Time after time. We were in the most delicate and tumultuous state of existence since any definition of "modern" football could be applied, and the future only seemed to be trending toward being even more stacked against us. It was bad enough that we hired Chad Morris before Pittman. Nothing about that math added up to a winning situation. And then we go and top ourselves by hiring someone who has never even been a coordinator, let alone head coach.
That's shite you'd expect from Arkansas State. Actually, ASU's previous four hires have all had OC or HC experience. All four have been SEC HCs.
Hiring coaches is always a bit of a crapshoot at the end of the day. But there ARE measures you can take to maximize your chances of success. Some hires are far less risky than others. We took none of those measures. At a time when it mattered the most. We let Ole Miss steal Lane Kiffin right out from under our noses when he was set to be hired, and then we hired an offensive line coach. That's what makes me say frick it, football is dead and we have other sports that we're actually good at for the other 2/3 of the year. The administration exudes the attitude that it couldn't give less of a shite.
Posted on 7/4/23 at 10:14 pm to VagueMessage
Houston nutt went 5-7 before going 10-4. There’s a lot wrong with your post but I don’t feel like diving into it and writing a paragraph. I get it your mind is made up that football is over for us and that’s fine. But honestly we’re in the same boat we’ve been in for 30 years, which is the right coach away from being a good/great program but probably never elite. I’d put us in the same category as Wisconsin/Iowa/Virginia tech/okie state/tcu now/k state now/ole miss/South Carolina/Missouri etc. will we win a natty no probably not but we can be a 10/11 win team. Which I’m okay with but we still need the right coach
This post was edited on 7/4/23 at 10:17 pm
Posted on 7/4/23 at 10:25 pm to VagueMessage
Ford cheated and Clemson was put on probation, barred from bowl games during the 1982 and 1983 seasons. Kicked off on TV during the 1983 and 1984 seasons. The NCAA found recruiting violations during the Charley Pell years but found it had continued under Ford.
I seriously doubt Frank allowed Ford any type of cheating or his record would be much better.
Also Ford was out of work between the 1989 and 1993 seasons, so he needed a check.
The Bert success at Wisconsin was a result of Barry Alvarez building up the program and never fully giving up his head coaching duties. So Bert never had full control of a program until he got to Arkansas.
I seriously doubt Frank allowed Ford any type of cheating or his record would be much better.
Also Ford was out of work between the 1989 and 1993 seasons, so he needed a check.
The Bert success at Wisconsin was a result of Barry Alvarez building up the program and never fully giving up his head coaching duties. So Bert never had full control of a program until he got to Arkansas.
Posted on 7/4/23 at 10:32 pm to VagueMessage
I wasn't and I'm still not impressed with Lane Kiffin.
The man is 1-2 or almost 0-3 against a coach with no prior head coaching experience.
He has been at programs with better history than Ole Miss and has done NOTHING with them.
The man is 1-2 or almost 0-3 against a coach with no prior head coaching experience.
He has been at programs with better history than Ole Miss and has done NOTHING with them.
Posted on 7/5/23 at 3:54 pm to Hawgnsincebirth55
quote:
Houston nutt went 5-7 before going 10-4. There’s a lot wrong with your post but I don’t feel like diving into it and writing a paragraph.
Cool. Then don't. Glad we got that cleared up.
Posted on 7/5/23 at 3:57 pm to dchog
quote:
I wasn't and I'm still not impressed with Lane Kiffin.
The man is 1-2 or almost 0-3 against a coach with no prior head coaching experience.
He has been at programs with better history than Ole Miss and has done NOTHING with them.
I'm not exactly high on Lane Kiffin either, but that's not really my point. He was my own personal #3 choice. It was the fact that we let Ole Miss do that to us. It was small-time. And he has actually done pretty well at Ole Miss, all things considered. He wouldn't have been bad for us. My main issue with him was I didn't expect he'd stay here longer than three or four years.
Posted on 7/5/23 at 4:17 pm to VagueMessage
What did he do? Have his bluff called?
Before HDN coaches didn't flirt with other jobs or try to leverage raises from them here.
Sutton crawled to Kentucky, Hatfield wasn't begged to not get on the plane. Holtz landed at Minnesota.
If there is other places you'd rather be, then go.
Before HDN coaches didn't flirt with other jobs or try to leverage raises from them here.
Sutton crawled to Kentucky, Hatfield wasn't begged to not get on the plane. Holtz landed at Minnesota.
If there is other places you'd rather be, then go.
Posted on 7/5/23 at 4:45 pm to Hawgnsincebirth55
quote:
liberty was a top 25 team when we played them, the year before and would’ve continued to be if freeze hadn’t made it known midway through the season he was leaving. You really think P5 means shite nowadays? You think Rutgers is better than Tulane last year? How about Colorado over Cincinnati? Gimme a break Liberty was a solid team the past 3 years.
The state of the program is not good if we are even having this conversation about Liberty.
I've been hearing from sauces that NIL just isn't there like it needs to be at UA. There's no 'Todd Graves' at UA chucking money at the program like Graves and others do at LSU. Frankly, I don't blame anyone for not wanting to burn their fortunes, for that money to eventually get spent at Peppermint Hippo.
This post was edited on 7/5/23 at 4:47 pm
Posted on 7/5/23 at 5:07 pm to Ronaldo Burgundiaz
quote:The Liberty loss gets blown so out of proportion. Bad loss? Yes, but people completely ignore they had a proven SEC coach and had played well above their normal stature since he got there in order to act like it was on par with the Citadel loss. Give me that loss over North Texas or Western Kentucky any day.
The state of the program is not good if we are even having this conversation about Liberty.
For frick's sake it wasn't even the first time Liberty had played an SEC team close during Freeze's tenure. They had just nearly beaten Ole Miss the year prior and they didn't even start to have to deal with the injury issues we did.
Posted on 7/5/23 at 8:41 pm to Hawgnsincebirth55
We will have the 16th- to 18th-ranked recruiting class this year.
Good for ninth in the SEC.
Good for ninth in the SEC.
Posted on 7/5/23 at 8:44 pm to dchog
quote:
If you are an SEC team trying to compete for SEC or national titles
Not sure what gives you the impression we are trying to win titles. We seem to be trying to be respectable and make money. In all sports (save that track and field stuff).
Posted on 7/5/23 at 10:14 pm to exiledhogfan
quote:
Not sure what gives you the impression we are trying to win titles. We seem to be trying to be respectable and make money. In all sports (save that track and field stuff).
Titles are more of a possibility in baseball and basketball, football would take a huge domino season where everything fell into place perfectly, imo.
There are only a very small handful of teams who can win it all now, we are not alone in that category. I like regular season football and the bowl games though.
Posted on 7/6/23 at 5:28 am to dchog
quote:
I can see Arkansas becoming another Wisconsin or Virginia Tech.
Wisconsin has played in the weakest division in the Big Ten and benefited. Arkansas doesn’t have that luxury.
Posted on 7/6/23 at 9:59 am to Hawgnsincebirth55
Our ADs’ overall culture of winning apathy, avarice, and try every unnecessary small-time gimmick when we have big-time resources is what personally makes me care less and less every year. I know that there’s “keeping up with the times” but the freaking band doesn’t even play anymore and every game they just blast “music” with fart noises and our team runs out and does dumb stuff and we win ugly or lose ugly. There’s no culture of excellence and those seasons have just been extra cringe. It isn’t wanted by tptb and they aren’t going to pay for it because too many idiots pay too much for a crap product. We can’t even beat aTm anymore, yet it’s usually a one-score game. If they wanted it, they’d already be planning for a successor for Pittman, who has done exactly what he was brought in for and what he’s capable of doing - building a more solid foundation and somewhat stabilizing us(love the guy, but he’s not taking us much/if any further). Basketball and baseball stand a much better chance and even then, we’re fighting uphill battles if we’re talking titles(for different reasons). Someday we’ll have a pie eating contest in the North or South endzone while the play clock is running “because they do this everywhere for “enhanced engagement and equity” and that will be it for me.
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