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Numbers look bleak for Arkansas high school football's reputation
Posted on 4/29/24 at 9:01 pm
Posted on 4/29/24 at 9:01 pm
Posted on 4/29/24 at 9:28 pm to dchog
Weird that most of the better football players in recent times have come from south arkansas considering it’s the lowest population area of the state, and least recruited. I guess warren plays a big part in that though.
Posted on 4/29/24 at 9:44 pm to Hawgnsincebirth55
Warren was been well coached and player developed for decades.
However it is declining in population like many South and Southeastern Arkansas towns.
However it is declining in population like many South and Southeastern Arkansas towns.
Posted on 4/29/24 at 10:14 pm to dchog
We will finally compete in football when NWA has tripled in size in 20 years. I just don't see us competing until it happens. We lose just as many south Arkansas guys as we get these days to other SEC teams
Posted on 4/29/24 at 11:07 pm to Hubbhogg
quote:but north Arkansas is already way more populated than south Arkansas. It doesn’t make sense they don’t produce more talent. There isn’t a single 7a school in south arkansas.
We will finally compete in football when NWA has tripled in size in 20 years. I just don't see us competing until it happens. We lose just as many south Arkansas guys as we get these days to other SEC team
Posted on 4/29/24 at 11:41 pm to Hubbhogg
I thought the issue was less the population, and more that the good football players aren't getting to play football. Isn't that what's up with central AR, at least? And NWA is already substantially bigger than it was 15 years ago when Bobby Petrino was here. That hasn't seemed to make a difference.
We're dead last in 4*+ talent produced in an SEC state, and it's like that every year. We also have the rare distinction of not having to share our recruiting pool with another in-state G5 program, and there being no pro football team to compete with. I don't think population is the whole answer, otherwise Mississippi wouldn't be outperforming us in amount of blue chip talent produced.
We're dead last in 4*+ talent produced in an SEC state, and it's like that every year. We also have the rare distinction of not having to share our recruiting pool with another in-state G5 program, and there being no pro football team to compete with. I don't think population is the whole answer, otherwise Mississippi wouldn't be outperforming us in amount of blue chip talent produced.
Posted on 4/30/24 at 12:37 am to Hawgnsincebirth55
quote:
but north Arkansas is already way more populated than south Arkansas. It doesn’t make sense they don’t produce more talent. There isn’t a single 7a school in south arkansas.
I wonder what it could be…
This post was edited on 4/30/24 at 12:52 am
Posted on 4/30/24 at 12:38 am to VagueMessage
Towns like Helena, Marianna, Forrest City, Barton, Clarendon, Pine Bluff, Blytheville, Osceola, Camden, El Dorado, Malvern, Magnolia, Nashville, Brinkley, Stuttgart, Texarkana, Smackover and West Memphis used to produce a decent amount of good football players.
But these towns have dried up due to population loss. That is just one of many reasons why Arkansas high school football continues on being in decline.
But these towns have dried up due to population loss. That is just one of many reasons why Arkansas high school football continues on being in decline.
Posted on 4/30/24 at 1:19 am to VagueMessage
The Little Rock metro has the players but are either poorly coached or not developed like they should. And many of them are not playing as they don't have any interest unless it is basketball.
It has improved recently but still not where they should be.
The problems with Arkansas high school football is not because it is a small state but a state full of communities that just don't care about football.
When a community shrinks in population, it has a negative impact on any sport and football suffers the most. But if the community doesn't care all, the football teams go from good to bad and then just flat out terrible. Yet these teams still have good players and have no clue what to do. They are undisciplined and quit when adversity shows up.
Arkansas does a terrible job maximizing the full potential of what it already has and people need to start caring more or the Razorbacks will just continue to be at the bottom.
It has improved recently but still not where they should be.
The problems with Arkansas high school football is not because it is a small state but a state full of communities that just don't care about football.
When a community shrinks in population, it has a negative impact on any sport and football suffers the most. But if the community doesn't care all, the football teams go from good to bad and then just flat out terrible. Yet these teams still have good players and have no clue what to do. They are undisciplined and quit when adversity shows up.
Arkansas does a terrible job maximizing the full potential of what it already has and people need to start caring more or the Razorbacks will just continue to be at the bottom.
Posted on 4/30/24 at 4:35 am to TheCheshireHog
quote:
I wonder what it could be…
Bingo
Posted on 4/30/24 at 5:57 am to TheCheshireHog
quote:while I agree there is some truth to this, it doesn’t explain why states like Kansas, Iowa, and north fricking Dakota are producing more football players than we are. And I don’t think it’s lack of interest in the communities either considering football popularity across the nation is at an all time high. My theory is the AAA not having rules in place like some of our border states that say you can’t Practice certain sports until a set day. For instance Texas and Louisiana both aren’t allowed to practice baseball on the diamond until some time in January. Basketball is similarly not allowed to be in the gym until a certain point in the fall. This encourages kids to play multiple sports unless they just want to be in the weight room a whole bunch. Because right now what we have in Arkansas is a bunch of kids that play AAU basketball or travel baseball year round and although they like football, it’s just something they do to pass the time in the fall during the week before their weekend tournaments. I think the razorbacks are also partly to blame considering you not only have an entire generation of kids who’ve grown up with them being arse, but an entire generation or parents too.
I wonder what it could be…
Posted on 4/30/24 at 9:55 am to Hawgnsincebirth55
quote:
it doesn’t explain why states like Kansas, Iowa, and north fricking Dakota are producing more football players than we are
Because they aren't. Who got drafted in a single year isn't a measure of that.
Iowa is pretty comparable. Kansas produces less talent. Sometimes they get some good ones out of KC metro area. Both of the Dakotas combined produce significantly less talent than Arkansas
Posted on 4/30/24 at 10:43 am to The Sultan of Swine
Arkansas has more football talent than Iowa, North Dakota and Kansas. They would be ranked above other states if maximized to full potential.
Those states get the most of what they have while Arkansas just loafs around.
Those states get the most of what they have while Arkansas just loafs around.
Posted on 4/30/24 at 10:56 am to Hawgnsincebirth55
It is absolutely one of the reasons it is bad due to lack of interest, essentially when you compare them to other states.
It wasn't like that before and unlike the coaches today, back then they didn't overlook blue collar Arkansas players. The best teams had players from Arkansas no matter they got drafted or not.
The small towns that use to produce good talent no longer do so. Politics, crime, lack of jobs or just lack of opportunities in general have played a key role in the decline in high school football.
It also doesn't help that Arkansas hasn't been good in football since the 80s and a few generations that grew up watching terrible football. That can hurt participation as no one wants to play for them.
It wasn't like that before and unlike the coaches today, back then they didn't overlook blue collar Arkansas players. The best teams had players from Arkansas no matter they got drafted or not.
The small towns that use to produce good talent no longer do so. Politics, crime, lack of jobs or just lack of opportunities in general have played a key role in the decline in high school football.
It also doesn't help that Arkansas hasn't been good in football since the 80s and a few generations that grew up watching terrible football. That can hurt participation as no one wants to play for them.
Posted on 4/30/24 at 11:56 am to dchog
If Arkansas schools don't start investing in better facilities, coaching upgrades and get serious about football, nothing will change.
And no, it has nothing to do with Razorback football sucking for the last 12+ years.
And no, it has nothing to do with Razorback football sucking for the last 12+ years.
Posted on 4/30/24 at 12:08 pm to The Sultan of Swine
Iowa is not comparable. They are top 15 in NFL players per capita.
Kansas and South Dakota both have more players per capita.
Only 12 states have fewer players per capita than Arkansas. Most of those being states that don’t prioritize athletics at all.
Kansas and South Dakota both have more players per capita.
Only 12 states have fewer players per capita than Arkansas. Most of those being states that don’t prioritize athletics at all.
Posted on 4/30/24 at 12:15 pm to dchog
Much of the NWA "talent" are kids of privilege who have had tons of sports-specific training, travel ball, and coaching clinics for their entire lives. They're good because their parents have invested in them being good, whether they have a ton of natural athleticism or not.
Those same kids also don't really need or want to play football in college. They'd rather go to the UofA and not play football (and pledge and party) than go to UCA or a smaller school that might prolong and continue their athletic career.
Those same kids also don't really need or want to play football in college. They'd rather go to the UofA and not play football (and pledge and party) than go to UCA or a smaller school that might prolong and continue their athletic career.
Posted on 4/30/24 at 12:23 pm to Razorbacking
quote:
Kansas and South Dakota both have more players per capita.
quote:
Iowa is not comparable.
Most years both have 3-5 four-star+, ~20 three-stars
2025
Ark: 1 four-stars, 12 three-stars
Iowa: 2 four-stars, 14 three-stars
2024
Ark 5 four-stars, 21 three-stars
Iowa 4 four-stars, 26 three-stars
Per capita really isn't the measure that's important. Especially considering Kansas is divided into at least 2 schools in terms of recruiting territory, then Mizzou as well if you're talking KC metro.
And South Dakota barely has people.
Posted on 4/30/24 at 12:30 pm to The Sultan of Swine
We are talking about states that produce the most football talent. Kansas having two FBS programs is entirely irrelevant.
21 NFL players were born in Iowa. Arkansas only has 8. Not comparable
21 NFL players were born in Iowa. Arkansas only has 8. Not comparable
Posted on 4/30/24 at 1:00 pm to Razorbacking
None of those states have the wasteland called the Delta that drag them down.
The area was always poor but they used to produce good football teams but now they are terrible.
Barton used to a power and now they struggle getting enough numbers to field a football team.
Helena for example always had talent but suffered from poor coaching and a community that didn't give them much support.
Now on the other end you have Greenwood that maximized its potential to the fullest extent and despite a lack of players over the years with big name offers, they win state titles. The community is fully engaged and they produced Tyler Wilson, Grant and Drew Morgan.
The area was always poor but they used to produce good football teams but now they are terrible.
Barton used to a power and now they struggle getting enough numbers to field a football team.
Helena for example always had talent but suffered from poor coaching and a community that didn't give them much support.
Now on the other end you have Greenwood that maximized its potential to the fullest extent and despite a lack of players over the years with big name offers, they win state titles. The community is fully engaged and they produced Tyler Wilson, Grant and Drew Morgan.
This post was edited on 4/30/24 at 1:03 pm
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