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re: member when Arkansas win ceiling wasn't 8 games
Posted on 11/13/16 at 12:26 pm to DaleDenton
Posted on 11/13/16 at 12:26 pm to DaleDenton
quote:
The west is.
That's the point though. When comparing the schedules between 2011 and 2016, and comparing the strength of the conference, I think that's one of the driving factors.
We now play more games in the West than we did back then. We no longer get a Vandy or Kentucky and South Carolina every year.
Can you really look at our 2011 schedule and think it was harder than our 2016 schedule?
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Posted on 11/13/16 at 12:28 pm to Kilgore Snout
Are you seriously arguing that the 2016 versions of Bama/LSU are better than the 2011 versions?
I'll give you Ole Miss and Auburn. 2011 MSU was much better than 2016 MSU.
I'll give you Ole Miss and Auburn. 2011 MSU was much better than 2016 MSU.
Posted on 11/13/16 at 12:28 pm to Kilgore Snout
I believe he's saying our 2016 schedule is harder.
Fun fact, next week will be our first P5 game this season where our opponent was not ranked at the time of the game. I don't think I've ever seen that before this late in the season.
Fun fact, next week will be our first P5 game this season where our opponent was not ranked at the time of the game. I don't think I've ever seen that before this late in the season.
Posted on 11/13/16 at 12:32 pm to Kilgore Snout
quote:
We no longer get a Vandy or Kentucky and South Carolina every year.
We only got Kentucky once from 2008-2011. Vandy under Franklin was a decent team. South Carolina was ranked in the top ten when we met in 2011 and we beat them (Bielema would have lost by 25+). This year we got an overrated Florida and historically bad Missouri from the East.
Posted on 11/13/16 at 12:35 pm to Arkansasrazorback
I don't think it's a question that 2016 Alabama is better than 2011 Alabama. I think this is Saban's most complete team and the best defense he has ever fielded.
LSU's defense in 2016 is better than it was in 2011 and that's against tougher competition. How is that not a fact?
2011 LSU schedule included a bad Florida (6-6), a bad Kentucky (5-7), an average Auburn (7-5), a bad MSU (6-6), a bad Ole Miss (2-10), and then the usual cupcakes of Western Kentucky and Northwestern State. They played a good Alabama, an above average Arkansas and West Virginia, and an above average Oregon.
LSU's defense in 2016 is better than it was in 2011 and that's against tougher competition. How is that not a fact?
2011 LSU schedule included a bad Florida (6-6), a bad Kentucky (5-7), an average Auburn (7-5), a bad MSU (6-6), a bad Ole Miss (2-10), and then the usual cupcakes of Western Kentucky and Northwestern State. They played a good Alabama, an above average Arkansas and West Virginia, and an above average Oregon.
Posted on 11/13/16 at 12:38 pm to Arkansasrazorback
quote:
We only got Kentucky once from 2008-2011. Vandy under Franklin was a decent team. South Carolina was ranked in the top ten when we met in 2011 and we beat them (Bielema would have lost by 25+). This year we got an overrated Florida and historically bad Missouri from the East.
Vanderbilt:
2008: 7-6
2009: 2-10
2010: 2-10
2011: 6-7
James Franklin was only there for 2011. And we won that on a late field goal if I remember right after being beat in all aspects of the game until that point.
Posted on 11/13/16 at 12:43 pm to Kilgore Snout
It took a goaline strip and 98 yard score by Jerry Franklin to even get us the opportunity to win on a missed field goal. The game should have been over then but we caught a huge break.
Posted on 11/13/16 at 12:44 pm to Kilgore Snout
I said they were decent, not great. They played in a bowl game, something Vandy will not do this year. They were much better than 2016 Missouri.
Posted on 11/13/16 at 12:44 pm to TheCheshireHog
quote:
I believe he's saying our 2016 schedule is harder.
And that's the point. He started off by saying it was easier now than when Petrino was here. But it objectively isn't.
I remember when people were calling for everyone to be fired almost weekly until November. Especially after we barely beat a Troy team (at home) that went 3-9 but out gained us and if it weren't for them having about 100 yards of penalties would have won.
Posted on 11/13/16 at 12:48 pm to Kilgore Snout
quote:
the job Bert has had to do.
Here's pretty much the deal: Our recruiting base sucks, compared to many others in the SEC.
Alabama
Auburn
LSU
aTm
Georgia
Florida
Ole Miss to some degree...
Tennessee most of the time.
All recruit higher rated athletes than we do, pretty consistently. All have better bases to recruit from.
Most of the time their talent level is going to be better than ours.
Does that mean we can't ever beat any of them? Of course not! But we are probably not going to beat any of them consistently in the long haul.
8 is probably our over under number that we can expect. Some years we may upset a couple of the higher talented group, some years we may catch one of two in a coaching change that hasn't gotten them playing a new system well yet... (see Florida and Tennessee)
We may hit 10 now and then when the cards fall right. Who knows, lightning could strike and we could get 11, 12 or even win a national championship. The odds of that happening though are going to be lower than those in the group above that I mentioned.
This post was edited on 11/13/16 at 12:50 pm
Posted on 11/13/16 at 12:48 pm to Kilgore Snout
2011 LSU was being touted as having the best résumé in CFB history prior to the egg they laid in Nola against a team they had already beaten. I mean LSU has three losses this year, how can you compare them to 2011 LSU with a straight face?
Posted on 11/13/16 at 12:50 pm to WonderWartHawg
I agree 100% with this.
Posted on 11/13/16 at 12:53 pm to Kilgore Snout
It was a one possession game until the last 10 minutes or so of then game.
Posted on 11/13/16 at 12:54 pm to Kilgore Snout
If you took the good teams from the east back then and traded them with the shitty teams from the west back then, then you would have the current SEC.
You can't tell me that most of the teams in the West would win the East this year, all would be top 3 at worst in the east.
Florida is, I guess, the best of the east and even we beat the brakes off them.
All these comparisons being thrown around are point less as it isn't even close to being apples to apples comparison with the data.
You can't tell me that most of the teams in the West would win the East this year, all would be top 3 at worst in the east.
Florida is, I guess, the best of the east and even we beat the brakes off them.
All these comparisons being thrown around are point less as it isn't even close to being apples to apples comparison with the data.
Posted on 11/13/16 at 12:56 pm to Kilgore Snout
quote:
specially after we barely beat a Troy team (at home) that went 3-9 but out gained us and if it weren't for them having about 100 yards of penalties would have won.
All I get out of this is that we won. Meanwhile, the fat man actually lost to Toledo and Rutgers, not almost lost...LOST.
He also "should have lost" to Louisiana Tech and Samford.
Posted on 11/13/16 at 12:57 pm to Arkansasrazorback
It is possible that LSU has a more talented roster, but has played a tougher schedule which has led not only to their record but the need for a new HC after the season when comparing the two.
Posted on 11/13/16 at 12:58 pm to Arkansasrazorback
quote:
He also "should have lost" to Louisiana Tech and Samford.
We could play the should have lost game with Petrino as well.
What we do know is he always loses the games that really matter every year, so the whole point in the conversation trying to trump him up is pretty damn moot.
Posted on 11/13/16 at 12:59 pm to Arkansasrazorback
quote:
2011 LSU was being touted as having the best résumé in CFB history prior to the egg they laid in Nola against a team they had already beaten. I mean LSU has three losses this year, how can you compare them to 2011 LSU with a straight face?
It's a logical fallacy to say that because 2011 LSU had a more difficult schedule than any team previous, that there is no way a team can have a more difficult schedule afterwards.
2011 LSU had a better offense than 2016 LSU, yes. But 2016 LSU has a better defense than 2011 LSU by all measures.
They beat Alabama in 2011 (a worse team than 2016 Alabama) when Alabama missed 4 field goals, had 2 late interceptions in the end zone, and then got the brakes beat off them in the re-match against the same roster. It just as easily could have been 31-9 Alabama winning in 2011.
They lost to an all time great 2016 Alabama team, a very good 2016 Auburn team when their winning touchdown was overturned, and by 2 to a top 8 Wisconsin team on the road. That's football and why you don't look just at records.
Posted on 11/13/16 at 1:00 pm to The Sultan of Swine
quote:
It was a one possession game until the last 10 minutes or so of then game.
It was not. LSU scored last with 10 minutes to go to go up by 24.
Posted on 11/13/16 at 1:01 pm to DaleDenton
quote:
If you took the good teams from the east back then and traded them with the shitty teams from the west back then, then you would have the current SEC.
You can't tell me that most of the teams in the West would win the East this year, all would be top 3 at worst in the east.
Florida is, I guess, the best of the east and even we beat the brakes off them.
All these comparisons being thrown around are point less as it isn't even close to being apples to apples comparison with the data.
I agree with you. The OP is wrong. The SEC West is far deeper in 2016 than it was in 2011. And the East is worse.
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