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re: Haselwood's comments about our staff

Posted on 1/14/19 at 6:39 pm to
Posted by chillmonster
Atlanta, GA
Member since Dec 2018
5072 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 6:39 pm to
quote:


I think he’ll be a stud, but the way you’re trying to prove that is incredibly misleading.


Im not trying to prove that Fields is anything. My only point is his seeming under-utilization is detrimental to UGA given his production when provided opportunity.

...especially considering that other true freshmen who performed worse than him are becoming or did become stars as they were provided increasing opportunity.

They're was no large gap between Fields and Lawrence coming in. Fields completed head to head with Trevor at camps all the time, and he was better as much as he was worse. HS players go to the same camps and they know that. Now if you're a rising star QB - the third highest rated ever like Fields - and you have a choice between UGA and Clemson where do you go?
Posted by lewis and herschel
Member since Nov 2009
11363 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 6:44 pm to
There was a huge gap between Lawrence and Fields coming in. Fields was numer one dt but Lawrence was number 1 pocket passer.

Lawrence was in a pass heavy offense while fields ran around and tried to make things happen with his size and arm.

Lawrence was way more polished.
Posted by FaCubeItches
Soviet Monica, People's Republic CA
Member since Sep 2012
5875 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 6:52 pm to
quote:

Every college in the USA would love to have Fields at QB.


Fairly sure that there is at least one out there that is happy with its current QB vis a vis Fields. Also fairly sure that there are a number of colleges which don't have football programs and could therefore not give a tuppeny frick about having him.
Posted by Dawgsontop34
Member since Jun 2014
42466 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 7:22 pm to
quote:

My only point is his seeming under-utilization is detrimental to UGA given his production when provided opportunity.

His production came against bad teams for the most part.

quote:

especially considering that other true freshmen who performed worse than him are becoming or did become stars as they were provided increasing opportunity.

Like who?

quote:

They're was no large gap between Fields and Lawrence coming in. Fields completed head to head with Trevor at camps all the time, and he was better as much as he was worse. HS players go to the same camps and they know that.

Huge difference between camps and games. I think I was a very rare person that thought Lawrence was too good to redshirt, but thought it would be the right move for Fields. We handled him poorly, I’m not denying that at all. I just think we expected too much of him right away (just like we did with Eason).
Posted by FaCubeItches
Soviet Monica, People's Republic CA
Member since Sep 2012
5875 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 7:28 pm to
quote:

My only point is his seeming under-utilization is detrimental to UGA given his production when provided opportunity


However, you previously stated that "the team lined up behind him [Fromm] and stepped away from Fields".

So, by your own admission, the team for which Fields played chose Fromm over him. That being the case, there is no "seeming under-utilization".

quote:

Now if you're a rising star QB - the third highest rated ever like Fields - and you have a choice between UGA and Clemson where do you go?


If I'm the third highest rated QB ever, I'm going to have a wider selection that Georgia or Clemson. And I'd go wherever I had the best opportunity to develop. further. Do my skills fit with their style of play? Do I get along with the coaches? Do I like the school? Am I going into a good situation; i.e., am I suddenly going to find myself without a good line/RBs/receiver due to graduation, players leaving early, etc.? One of the lowest concerns on my list is going to be "Will I get a ton of playing time as a freshman?", in no small part because that comes with as much risk as reward - if I go out and get eaten alive, as can easily happen to a freshman, that's not going to do wonders for either my confidence or my future marketability.

Beyond all of that, consider the track record of the guys who were touted as potential stud quarterbacks at UGA in recent history:
1) Ramsey - flopped at QB, serviceable punter.
2) Park - flop, transferred, and flopped again.
3) LeMay - flop, transferred, succeeded at FCS level.
4) Eason - moderate success, supplanted, transferred.
5) Fields - not immediately hailed as program's messiah, transferred.
So out of five supposed bad-arse quarterbacks, none accomplished much of anything at UGA, and four left. Of those four, two essentially ended up being zeros at the D1 level, and the jury is still out on the other two. "Potential" doesn't guarantee results.
Posted by chillmonster
Atlanta, GA
Member since Dec 2018
5072 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 9:07 pm to
Team meant coaches. I don't think players had any problems with him.
Posted by Long Dawg
Acworth, GA
Member since Dec 2017
2046 posts
Posted on 1/15/19 at 9:43 am to
Fields was ranked ahead of Lawrence before he broke his finger - that had nothing to do with the category (DT vs Pro).

The only significant difference between the two QBs was the situations they came into with the existing starter and the attitudes of the HC/OC.

Fields showed he was ready to play more on the small sample size we had as he was productive all season throwing and running. It was obvious Chaney and Kirby didn’t want a QB controversy and played Fields accordingly. While Fromm played terrifically after LSU game, he was average prior to the LSU game.

I know the differing view is “Fields got what he earned in practice” or “it was open competition because Kirby said it was” - I don’t believe that was the case.

Regardless, this is over and Fields will prove one way or another his worth and value as a QB - I expect him to be a very good QB.
Posted by Long Dawg
Acworth, GA
Member since Dec 2017
2046 posts
Posted on 1/15/19 at 9:53 am to
Players had no issues with Fields and there have been no parting shots at him from teammates. Andrew Thomas Just accentuated Fromm’s attributes but some point to that as shot at Fields. I don’t think so.

Great QBs/Heisman winners have transferred from other schools - look no further than Baker Mayfield and Kyler Murray.

It’s rather childish the need for UGA fans that feel the need to run down a kid doing what is best for himself and his future. Adults do it every day when they switch jobs, go to a competitor, etc.

I don’t like that Justin left and was looking forward to him bringing a Natty to my Dawgs. It didn’t work out because we already had a really good QB ahead of him and they were only separated by a year in school. shite happens
Posted by lewis and herschel
Member since Nov 2009
11363 posts
Posted on 1/15/19 at 9:56 am to
Will you feel the same way when he and his lawyers throw us under the bus?
Posted by Dawgsontop34
Member since Jun 2014
42466 posts
Posted on 1/15/19 at 9:57 am to
quote:

Fields was ranked ahead of Lawrence before he broke his finger - that had nothing to do with the category (DT vs Pro).


That had to do with ESPN bumping him bc he was playing in the UA game, and the Fields family didn’t give out interviews to Rivals for keeping him second.

quote:

The only significant difference between the two QBs was the situations they came into with the existing starter and the attitudes of the HC/OC.


Fromm vs. Bryant is also a significant difference.

quote:

Fields showed he was ready to play more on the small sample size we had as he was productive all season throwing and running. It was obvious Chaney and Kirby didn’t want a QB controversy and played Fields accordingly. While Fromm played terrifically after LSU game, he was average prior to the LSU game.


Agree we mishandled it, but Fields was good against bad competition. Some of the reads and decisions he made were pretty poor (but also very understandable considering he was a freshman). I think Fromm was good before the LSU game, and terrible in that game. He was great afterwards.

I expect Fields to be very good going forward. I just don’t think he was there yet, especially not in our system that requires QBs to make multiple reads.
Posted by Long Dawg
Acworth, GA
Member since Dec 2017
2046 posts
Posted on 1/15/19 at 10:09 am to
The multiple reads thing is way overblown. Fields would come in for 1-2 plays at a time and he was trying to maximize his production.

QB is also not like most other positions. You gotta get into a rhythm. How do you do that with a play here and a play there? The obvious answer is you can’t. Fields knew every time he came in he was about to come right back out. Even in the cupcake games and huge leads by halftime, Fields didn’t get any run until late in 4th qtr and mostly told to hand the ball off. To say the handling of Fields was poor is understatement of the year - and if it frustrated you and me, you know it tore up Fields and Pablo.
This post was edited on 1/15/19 at 10:10 am
Posted by lewis and herschel
Member since Nov 2009
11363 posts
Posted on 1/15/19 at 10:10 am to
Fromm has to learn to deal with mock or disguised defensive coverages.

Improves wr play and eliminating drops will help. Very few passes hit the ground in 17.
Posted by Long Dawg
Acworth, GA
Member since Dec 2017
2046 posts
Posted on 1/15/19 at 10:11 am to
Fromm was shockingly poor at adjusting to the Texas blitzes.
Posted by HTDawg
Member since Sep 2016
6683 posts
Posted on 1/15/19 at 10:14 am to
quote:

I think Fromm was good before the LSU game, and terrible in that game.


Fromm was spotty and streaky at best up through the LSU game. He was terrible in the LSU game and in the first half against Mizzou. He was not great in the first half against South Carolina and Tennessee either. After the LSU game he was great, but Fromm had a number of slow first halfs.

As for this entire argument about Fields, it's completely pointless. He's gone and we'll find out sooner or later just how good he is. I expect he's going to be great which is going to make his loss sting even more, like watching two Georgia boys Watson and Lawrence lead Clemson to titles.
This post was edited on 1/15/19 at 10:18 am
Posted by Long Dawg
Acworth, GA
Member since Dec 2017
2046 posts
Posted on 1/15/19 at 10:15 am to
I am not all torn up about the baseball player and N-word stuff.

My understanding is the NCAA doesn’t even have to publicly state why they give a waiver and my guess is they won’t.

Even if that is reason used and even if the waiver is granted based on that, no article could be written without showing UGA handled it perfectly.

This is more about NCAA changing their standards and granting waivers easily.
Posted by Dawgsontop34
Member since Jun 2014
42466 posts
Posted on 1/15/19 at 10:25 am to
quote:

Fromm was spotty and streaky at best up through the LSU game. He was terrible in the LSU game and in the first half against Mizzou. He was not great in the first half against South Carolina and Tennessee either. After the LSU game he was great, but Fromm had a number of slow first halfs.


Completely agree. I just generalized it as good. He was pretty mediocre in most first halves and really good in the second halves.

I know we disagree on the amount of playing time he should have gotten this year, but we both agree the way that it was handled was wrong.

Long Dawg, I agree that you can't get in a rhythm only playing a play or two at a time. I thought it was so weird we pretty much took it out of the playbook after the LSU game (unless it was a situational running down) until the Bama game where we tried to get tricky again.
Posted by Malefic Runt
Try my robe
Member since Oct 2018
1266 posts
Posted on 1/15/19 at 11:01 am to
quote:

He was pretty mediocre in most first halves and really good in the second halves. 


Which is what was most problematic with working in qb2 snaps. Wasnt like we had a Tua type situation where we put lesser teams away in the first half. Which is why its hard for me to envision the staff handling it much different. Particularly if they werent seeing what they needed to see on the practice field from JF
Posted by Long Dawg
Acworth, GA
Member since Dec 2017
2046 posts
Posted on 1/15/19 at 11:04 am to
There was just no rhyme nor reason to how Justin was used all year long. Evertime you thought there would be a change in strategy the following week it would go right back to a regression.

Florida would be one example. After a lackluster start of year and then Jake layed the egg at LSU as one inflection point. Another, the UMASS game - for all the “It was UMass” poo-poo, Fields was dropping dimes 40-50yds down the field. He was cut loose in that game. If Chaney and Kirby were serious about developing Fields in 2019, there were 3-4 other games where he could have been unleashed for an entire 2nd half of football in a blowout game. I believe it was purposeful not to do so because there is no logical explanation not to do it.
Posted by FaCubeItches
Soviet Monica, People's Republic CA
Member since Sep 2012
5875 posts
Posted on 1/15/19 at 11:22 am to
quote:

Team meant coaches.


So, the guys who are paid specifically to evaluate and train the talent they need to give the program the best chance of winning went with Fromm over Fields. Still not a big argument for Fields being under-used/misused.

quote:

I don't think players had any problems with him.


Damning with faint praise. "Well, yeah, he's okay." Didn't see any mass player push to keep him, or lamenting his departure.
Posted by Long Dawg
Acworth, GA
Member since Dec 2017
2046 posts
Posted on 1/15/19 at 11:29 am to
Knowing Kirby and controlling the message, it’s a good bet that he told his players that they weren’t to discuss Fields with sports media and/or on social media - if you think on it, there has been almost no chatter on the subject from players. Coincidence? I think not.
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