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Posted on 6/12/20 at 9:59 pm to Tide or Die87
quote:
I don't care about no studies.
Yeah let’s just throw logic out the window when it suits you
Posted on 6/12/20 at 10:25 pm to YStar
He's a fricking racist. Period!
Posted on 6/13/20 at 1:25 am to TideCPA
I'm not in my feelings at all and that video is terrible but no way I believe that the amount of black people that have been killed in tape is close to any other race.
Posted on 6/13/20 at 3:27 am to LATIDER
(no message)
This post was edited on 11/8/20 at 4:09 am
Posted on 6/13/20 at 7:36 am to Kraut Dawg
quote:
Not that my opinion matters that much, but if people have to self-promote to make money, they need to be careful of sharing their political opinions.
Unless you have financial independence or a job that is completely insulated from public opinion of you as a person you damn sure better be careful what you say and do on social media.
Posted on 6/13/20 at 8:18 am to LATIDER
Posted on 6/13/20 at 9:16 am to Tide or Die87
quote:
I'm not in my feelings at all
Yeah you are. When you want to deny the stats and studies completely, and just look at anecdotal evidence, you are relying on your feelings.
Cops have plenty of issues (change is needed there) but to act like there’s a huge prevalence of cops going around and killing unarmed people (regardless of race) is just wrong.
This post was edited on 6/13/20 at 9:18 am
Posted on 6/13/20 at 2:05 pm to Tide or Die87
quote:
Funny Maine was just upset at the time.
Who gives a frick if he was “angry”. His true heart came out. frick that piece of trash
Posted on 6/13/20 at 3:24 pm to Tide or Die87
It's not racism, dummy. It's statism, giving police the power to do just about anything with little recourse. Think War on Drugs, for example. Same isht in Jamaica, but is that racism as well?
Posted on 6/13/20 at 4:40 pm to Tide or Die87
Cops kill more Caucasians. However, African Americans are killed at a higher prevalence vs percentage of population. Statistically, the standard deviation would be much higher for African American police killings. I do believe that there are racist and bigoted cops, just as there are those same individuals in corporate america, the military, sports, and etc and of all colors and shapes. Come to California, and the Asian and S. Americans tend to have more hatred toward others. There are no data to support my assertions. These are only based on my dealings with them and from what I hear others state. Hell, I played ball in college with an All-American that hated other races if you were not on playing on the same team
I have dealt with police on many different levels. I have been harassed as a youth, while living in my mother's shite hole neighborhood. Had some of my father's police friends celebrate in my success, and offer amazing amounts of support after his death. I have, also, gone to court after one shot my younger brother in the back, where I was fortunate to learn that the news reported fallacies, based on the police report. Finally, in my latest interaction, my neighbor called the cops and stated that I was threatening them after I asked for them to trim their palm trees that were leaving fronds on my property. In my opinion, it's more about class. My interaction at my 4,000 square ft house, on hole 7, was much different than my interaction in the "hood." Either way, are there some inherent biases? Yes. Are they justified? Sometimes. But, none of this allows for innocent people's property and possessions to be destroyed with malice and wanton disregard, and if after doing so, you choose to only support one side based on a pseudo nomenclature (skin color), then you are a bigot and a racist. If that's the path that any individual chooses to follow, they deserve what is coming. A forthright conversation is easier to discern than a tantrum.
If you do not believe that it's more socioeconomically based, look up the story about Rhogena Nicholas and Dennis Tuttle, and their murder in their trailer park. The chance of that same occurrence happening here, in Westlake Village, is close to zero. By the way, the officer that lied and set up their killing was black. Unfortunately, this is what happens when an entity is allowed unparalleled-operational-freedom with little oversight.
I have dealt with police on many different levels. I have been harassed as a youth, while living in my mother's shite hole neighborhood. Had some of my father's police friends celebrate in my success, and offer amazing amounts of support after his death. I have, also, gone to court after one shot my younger brother in the back, where I was fortunate to learn that the news reported fallacies, based on the police report. Finally, in my latest interaction, my neighbor called the cops and stated that I was threatening them after I asked for them to trim their palm trees that were leaving fronds on my property. In my opinion, it's more about class. My interaction at my 4,000 square ft house, on hole 7, was much different than my interaction in the "hood." Either way, are there some inherent biases? Yes. Are they justified? Sometimes. But, none of this allows for innocent people's property and possessions to be destroyed with malice and wanton disregard, and if after doing so, you choose to only support one side based on a pseudo nomenclature (skin color), then you are a bigot and a racist. If that's the path that any individual chooses to follow, they deserve what is coming. A forthright conversation is easier to discern than a tantrum.
If you do not believe that it's more socioeconomically based, look up the story about Rhogena Nicholas and Dennis Tuttle, and their murder in their trailer park. The chance of that same occurrence happening here, in Westlake Village, is close to zero. By the way, the officer that lied and set up their killing was black. Unfortunately, this is what happens when an entity is allowed unparalleled-operational-freedom with little oversight.
Posted on 6/13/20 at 5:10 pm to calgrad
quote:
Cops kill more Caucasians. However, African Americans are killed at a higher prevalence vs percentage of population. Statistically, the standard deviation would be much higher for African American police killings.
Ok, but just because a population is killed by police at a higher per capita rate relative to others doesn’t tell you anything about systemic discrimination. 95% of those killed by police are men, yet they comprise only half the population. Is that, therefore, conclusive evidence of systemic misandry? No, of course not; anyone would say that’s absurd.
Additionally, a large chunk of black men killed by police are killed by black officers. This is because traditionally the demographic constitution of a given police force is generally reflective of the local population, because that’s who they have to draw from.
Again, we can go off feelings, or we can use empirical evidence. The latter suggests the narrative that black men are hunted and killed for sport by police because of their skin color is nonsense. That doesn’t mean there isn’t racism in enforcement, however, which studies show certainly exists.
Harvard study
This post was edited on 6/13/20 at 5:14 pm
Posted on 6/13/20 at 7:45 pm to TideCPA
See, I can post a link, too. LINK /
And another: LINK
Please post the section where I stated that police are hunting Black men, for sport. African Americans are killed at a higher clip. That was my point, and it is true. "Lower class" individuals are treated by the justice system much differently, also. That was another of my points, it's also true. Have I been treated differently by the police because of the color of my skin? I don't know, which is why that point wasn't made. Next time, read thoroughly, what I post before bloviating about a point that I didn't make. I said socioeconomic, period. Outside of the Houston example, I never stated anything about the color of the officers that were doing the killing. I don't give a shite. Target practice and combat skill training on civilians is wrong. There are countless incidents of this. Spare me the ridiculousness of you searching through Google to try to prove that systemic discrimination doesn't exist. bullshite, it does. Discrimination is not, solely, based upon skin color or gender. That's another demographic issue, which we can discuss all day. If that's where you want to go next, we can. For every study you pull, I'll post one, and the pedantry will never cease.
And another: LINK
Please post the section where I stated that police are hunting Black men, for sport. African Americans are killed at a higher clip. That was my point, and it is true. "Lower class" individuals are treated by the justice system much differently, also. That was another of my points, it's also true. Have I been treated differently by the police because of the color of my skin? I don't know, which is why that point wasn't made. Next time, read thoroughly, what I post before bloviating about a point that I didn't make. I said socioeconomic, period. Outside of the Houston example, I never stated anything about the color of the officers that were doing the killing. I don't give a shite. Target practice and combat skill training on civilians is wrong. There are countless incidents of this. Spare me the ridiculousness of you searching through Google to try to prove that systemic discrimination doesn't exist. bullshite, it does. Discrimination is not, solely, based upon skin color or gender. That's another demographic issue, which we can discuss all day. If that's where you want to go next, we can. For every study you pull, I'll post one, and the pedantry will never cease.
Posted on 6/13/20 at 7:58 pm to calgrad
That’s a nice wall of text, but this thread diverged by someone making the claim that white people will never understand “cops killing you all the time without repercussions.” That’s just flat out false. It happens all the time to both white and black Americans, and there is literally no empirical evidence that police are more likely to use lethal force based solely on the color of a person’s skin. Blacks are killed by police at a higher rate because they are more likely to be involved in violent crime. The portion of deaths by police (regardless of race) involving an unarmed suspect is small, though inarguably still too large.
Also, I’m not sure where you got the assumption that I believe racism doesn’t exist, even in policing. It absolutely does - even the study I linked above shows that non-lethal force is used disproportionately based on race. And it’s well established that blacks are more likely to be arrested for victimless offenses than whites, despite relatively similar rates of drug use and the like among races.
I’m simply tired of false narratives being thrown around with people too scared to call them out due to fear of the woke mob.
Also, I’m not sure where you got the assumption that I believe racism doesn’t exist, even in policing. It absolutely does - even the study I linked above shows that non-lethal force is used disproportionately based on race. And it’s well established that blacks are more likely to be arrested for victimless offenses than whites, despite relatively similar rates of drug use and the like among races.
I’m simply tired of false narratives being thrown around with people too scared to call them out due to fear of the woke mob.
Posted on 6/13/20 at 8:21 pm to TideCPA
Ok. I get it. I do not believe that assumption about white people, either. It's cantankerous and counterproductive to moving forward. That is an argument begun by a sector that is looking to further their narrative. My Larger Education: Being Chapters from My Experience by Booker T. Washington has a couple of profound quotes:
I am afraid that there is a certain class of race-problem solvers who don't want the patient to get well, because as long as the disease holds out they have not only an easy means of making a living, but also an easy medium through which to make themselves prominent before the public.
AND
There is another class of coloured people who make a business of keeping the troubles, the wrongs, and the hardships of the Negro race before the public. Having learned that they are able to make a living out of their troubles, they have grown into the settled habit of advertising their wrongs — partly because they want sympathy and partly because it pays. Some of these people do not want the Negro to lose his grievances, because they do not want to lose their jobs.
Those groups I hate. They, deliberately, stem progress for their gain. frick them.
I am afraid that there is a certain class of race-problem solvers who don't want the patient to get well, because as long as the disease holds out they have not only an easy means of making a living, but also an easy medium through which to make themselves prominent before the public.
AND
There is another class of coloured people who make a business of keeping the troubles, the wrongs, and the hardships of the Negro race before the public. Having learned that they are able to make a living out of their troubles, they have grown into the settled habit of advertising their wrongs — partly because they want sympathy and partly because it pays. Some of these people do not want the Negro to lose his grievances, because they do not want to lose their jobs.
Those groups I hate. They, deliberately, stem progress for their gain. frick them.
Posted on 6/14/20 at 10:10 am to calgrad
quote:
calgrad
As a very conservative, white male I just want to say your last few posts in this thread have been well spoken, fair, and reasonable. I'm not sure why you're getting a lot of grief over them.
I do want to address one of your observations.
quote:
Finally, in my latest interaction, my neighbor called the cops and stated that I was threatening them after I asked for them to trim their palm trees that were leaving fronds on my property. In my opinion, it's more about class. My interaction at my 4,000 square ft house, on hole 7, was much different than my interaction in the "hood."
I have no doubt this is 100% true. The thing people have to grasp is the why. The reason you got better interaction this last time wasn't because the police set out to pick on poor people or black people or any other type of people. How they AND WE react is based on our experiences more than any other single factor.
You got a better experience this time because people who live in the 4,000 square foot homes beside hole 7 virtually never run from, fight with, or shoot the police. They've got too much to lose. They aren't seen as a threat because experience has shown they aren't one.
I work EMS in a small semi-rural bedroom community. About 80% white, 15% black, and a mix of everything else. There are no 4,000 square foot homes on the 7th and there are no urban slums. Your pretty typical bedroom community. Crime's pretty low, but it still happens. We have an intentional shooting (not accidental or suicide - someone shot someone else on purpose) every year or so. Over my 21+ years, I've been to a dozen or more. I've never been to a call where a white person intentionally shot someone so the next time my radio goes off, no matter how much I try you know what assumptions are going to be in the back of my mind.
You can train, train, train, and train some more but when you see the same people doing the same things day after day after day it will influence how you interact with that part of the population. Anybody who says it won't isn't being honest with themselves.
I can't tell you how to fix it. I can't tell you if it can be fixed because it's the result of simple human nature and survival instinct.
Back in the (D) primaries, Kamala Harris put forth the idea of an NTSB style agency to investigate LE involved incidents. That's an EXCELLENT idea. No blame, no looking to exonerate or charge, no authority to force any changes on anyone so no reason for anyone to fear being a part of the process. Just look an an incident from top to bottom and see what could be done to make it better the next time. That body should be established immediately. If you put something like that together that involved experts in LE, mental health, human behavior, etc all looking at the same incidents at the same time you could very likely come up with better procedures and tactics that reduced the chances that an interaction will go bad.
I said reduce. They'll never be eliminated because of what I said above - people that feel like they've got nothing to lose are going to do things others don't and sometimes that's going to put officers in a place where they have to use extreme force.
Posted on 6/14/20 at 12:24 pm to JustGetItRight
quote:
Finally, in my latest interaction, my neighbor called the cops and stated that I was threatening them after I asked for them to trim their palm trees that were leaving fronds on my property. In my opinion, it's more about class. My interaction at my 4,000 square ft house, on hole 7, was much different than my interaction in the "hood."
As a white person, this type of behavior I do NOT understand and condemn with the utmost disgust and disrespect. Just like the dumb bitch walking her dog unleashed in Central Park when politely asked by a man of color to leash her dog as required by law, she calls the cops and says he’s threatening her. I’m glad it backfired on her and she lost her job and hopefully learned a lesson.
What possesses people to think with the twisted logic that if you interact with a person of a different race and they disagree with your opinion, they are threatening you? I grew up in a blue collar/lower white collar rural neighborhood and went to school with that socioeconomic group. It was mostly middle class but there was a significant percentage of poor kids too. It was also about a 65/35 ratio of white and black. I had friends in both groups. I cannot fathom feeling threatened by someone unless they were holding a weapon on me.
Is it ignorance or unfamiliarity that leads to such thought processes? I can’t wrap my head around it. By the same token, I don’t understand why when such an incident occurs, a vocal segment of the black community steps up and basically says it’s just white people being white people. They are all that way.
I understand that as a white person, I don’t completely comprehend the systematic bias and racism people of color deal with every day. I acknowledge that we have a long way to go to improve these things and I am fully behind these efforts. I acknowledge that I have blind spots and some inherent racist tendencies just because of the society I live in. But don’t equate me with David Duke or skinheads just because of the color of MY skin. Maybe I’m wrong but it is my experience that most people I know want equality and justice for all and not the BS that’s going on.
Posted on 6/14/20 at 12:33 pm to phil4bama
quote:
Just like the dumb bitch walking her dog unleashed in Central Park when politely asked by a man of color to leash her dog as required by law, she calls the cops and says he’s threatening her. I’m glad it backfired on her and she lost her job and hopefully learned a lesson.
I can't understand why she wasn't charged. She straight out called 911 and lied.
Maybe New York doesn't fool with things like that but where I live that catches a charge.
Posted on 6/14/20 at 4:31 pm to 1BamaRTR
Those stars and studies are BS. Majority of the time they won't even hold the cops responsible for the deaths.
Posted on 6/14/20 at 5:33 pm to Tide or Die87
So to be clear, any evidence that challenges your beliefs is "BS" and not worthy of consideration?
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