Started By
Message
0
Posted on 8/2/15 at 1:32 am to Korin
quote:
Why does it matter to you anyhow? It's not like anyone's saying Alabama shouldn't claim 1964.
It matters to me because you have posters, like this Arkansas poster, claiming Arkansas was the "real" champion in '64.
There were a champion, not the accepted and promoted champion that was awarded the big dog trophies.
What does it matter to you?
Posted on 8/2/15 at 1:35 am to Roger Klarvin
quote:
Before 2000 they would fall around 5th-6th on this list,
They actually have rankings on there thru 2000. Why don't you check them out then come back and post what you found
Posted on 8/2/15 at 1:36 am to Alert Mi
quote:
It matters to me because you have posters, like this Arkansas poster, claiming Arkansas was the "real" champion in '64.
I have no dog in this fight, but both major polls didn't consider bowl games that year, something that was known well ahead of time. Both polls had Alabama at #1. Therefore Alabama is the only legitimate champ for 1964. Not sure why this is difficult.
This post was edited on 8/2/15 at 1:37 am
Posted on 8/2/15 at 1:37 am to Alert Mi
quote:
That is just what fans of a team that only have the Grantland Rice trophy tell themselves. Everyone else knows better.
You don't need a trophy to tell you who the true champion was in '64. The very article you linked earlier told you that.
quote:
Arkansas, denied the '64 national title it deserved ...
Posted on 8/2/15 at 1:41 am to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
I have no dog in this fight, but both major polls didn't consider bowl games that year, something that was known well ahead of time. Both polls had Alabama at #1. Therefore Alabama is the only legitimate champ for 1964. Not sure why this is difficult.
It's not difficult, not at all. What we have here are Arkansas and Florida revisionists.
They want to apply the standards of a more modern time-period to the 1960's.
Posted on 8/2/15 at 1:41 am to Alert Mi
quote:
It matters to me because you have posters, like this Arkansas poster, claiming Arkansas was the "real" champion in '64.
I never claimed that until you said Alabama was the "real" champion. Fact is that the AP and UPI considered Alabama the champion. The FWAA waited until after the bowl games and selected Arkansas. From what I understand, public opinion would also have selected Arkansas, which seems like common sense to me. I've never heard of the McArthur trophy, so I doubt that it's on the same level as the Grantland Rice.
Ah, I looked up the McArthur and now know that it's the trophy awarded by the NFF. Didn't know that or that they awarded their '64 trophy to Notre Dame. Guess we have company.
This post was edited on 8/2/15 at 1:46 am
Posted on 8/2/15 at 1:42 am to Alert Mi
quote:
It's not difficult, not at all. What we have here are Arkansas and Florida revisionists.
They want to apply the standards of a more modern time-period to the 1960's.
How do you figure that? If anything, it's quite the opposite.Posted on 8/2/15 at 1:43 am to redeye
quote:
You don't need a trophy to tell you who the true champion was in '64. The very article you linked earlier told you that.
quote:
Arkansas, denied the '64 national title it deserved ...
Let me ask you this, if 5 years from now, the rules of college football are changed again and there is an 8 team play-off, will Ohio State's NC last season still be valid?
Posted on 8/2/15 at 1:44 am to redeye
quote:
I never claimed that until you said Alabama was the "real" champion. Fact is that the AP and UPI considered Alabama the champion. The FWAA waited until after the bowl games and selected Arkansas. From what I understand, public opinion would also have selected Arkansas, which seems like common sense to me. I've never heard of the McArthur trophy, so I doubt that it's on the same level as the Grantland Rice.
I hate Alabama, and if I could argue against one of their NCs I would but in the pre-playoff era there were 2 major selectors and in 1964 they both picked Alabama. Good, bad, right, wrong...it just doesn't matter. The 2 major sectors both picked Alabama. Period. You can pull out the Dunkel Index or whatever but it just doesn't mean anything. Arkansas finished #2 in the polls that count.
This post was edited on 8/2/15 at 1:45 am
Posted on 8/2/15 at 1:48 am to redeye
quote:
How do you figure that? If anything, it's quite the opposite.
If you want to discuss this like adults, why not try making just one post without a laughing emoticon. That is so sophomoric.
You wish to claim that, no matter the tradition, the ritual, the widely accepted routine of the time, Arkansas somehow deserved the two most desired trophies.
In 1964, you would have seemingly been content if the AP and UPI had, at the very end of the regular season, announced that they would immediately change their template of awarding their trophies and give it to Arkansas.
That would not have been fair or honest and they would have lost a lot of credence.
Posted on 8/2/15 at 1:48 am to cas4t
quote:
I remember 2007 SECCG
I can't remember Tennessee having a 2 or 3 win season. Can you remember LSU having any of those?
Posted on 8/2/15 at 1:49 am to Alert Mi
quote:
Let me ask you this, if 5 years from now, the rules of college football are changed again and there is an 8 team play-off, will Ohio State's NC last season still be valid?
That's irrelevant, and once again, I never said the AP didn't award Alabama it's '64 trophy. Why do you keep suggesting I did?
Posted on 8/2/15 at 1:51 am to Korin
quote:
quote:
The governing body of the sport also doesn't recognize NC's,
Wrong again.
What organization do you consider the governing body of the sport?
Posted on 8/2/15 at 1:53 am to BigOrangeBri
quote:
I can't remember Tennessee having a 2 or 3 win season. Can you remember LSU having any of those?
This is what Tennessee fans have been reduced to
Posted on 8/2/15 at 1:53 am to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
I hate Alabama, and if I could argue against one of their NCs I would but in the pre-playoff era there were 2 major selectors and in 1964 they both picked Alabama. Good, bad, right, wrong...it just doesn't matter. The 2 major sectors both picked Alabama. Period. You can pull out the Dunkel Index or whatever but it just doesn't mean anything. Arkansas finished #2 in the polls that count.
Then you also remember when the UPI was considered more relevant then the AP, right? Regardless, I'll repeat that I never said the AP or the UPI didn't select Alabama in '64. I've said that many times during this discussion already, but Alert keeps pretending I never did.
However, I disagree that those "2 major selectors" meant any more then the FWAA did back then. They certainly do today, but back then?
Posted on 8/2/15 at 1:55 am to redeye
quote:
quote:
Let me ask you this, if 5 years from now, the rules of college football are changed again and there is an 8 team play-off, will Ohio State's NC last season still be valid?
That's irrelevant, and once again, I never said the AP didn't award Alabama it's '64 trophy. Why do you keep suggesting I did?
It was the AP and the UPI, firstly. Secondly, I've not stated that you have claimed the AP didn't award Alabama it's trophy.
I'd like a link to that quote please.
And tertiary, my analogy is extremely relevant. Ohio State won it's trophies while playing under the widely accepted and agreed upon rules of the time.
If those rules later change, it doesn't invalidate Ohio State's 2015 NC.
Posted on 8/2/15 at 1:56 am to Alert Mi
quote:
What organization do you consider the governing body of the sport?
He's probably talking about the NCAA. They recognize awarded NC's here:
LINK
Note that Alabama, Arkansas and Notre Dame are all recognized for '64, even though your very own link seems to think Arkansas deserved it solely.
Posted on 8/2/15 at 1:56 am to redeye
quote:
However, I disagree that those "2 major selectors" meant any more then the FWAA did back then. They certainly do today, but back then?
The AP and UPI/Coaches are the only 2 major selectors throughout college football history. Period. If you didn't finish #1 in one of those polls, you can't claim you were National Chanps.
Posted on 8/2/15 at 1:59 am to Alert Mi
quote:
Secondly, I've not stated that you have claimed the AP didn't award Alabama it's trophy.
I'd like a link to that quote please.
quote:
And tertiary, my analogy is extremely relevant. Ohio State won it's trophies while playing under the widely accepted and agreed upon rules of the time.
If those rules later change, it doesn't invalidate Ohio State's 2015 NC.
I think you answered your own question. Again, no one is suggesting that Alabama's '64 title is invalid. If I'm missing your point, please correct me, but that seems to be what you're saying. I'm sure many disagree with it, but that doesn't make it invalid. Just like Arkansas' isn't invalid, which is why the NCAA recognizes it equally.
Page 8 of 15
Popular
Back to top
Follow SECRant for SEC Football News