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re: How similar is Rick Ray's situation to Croom's situation?
Posted on 2/22/15 at 8:42 am to TaxmanMSU
Posted on 2/22/15 at 8:42 am to TaxmanMSU
The talent level that Ray recruits will never be able to compete with the likes of UK or UF. He's had three years to recruit and has not brought in a single player better than a 3*. I know Quinndary is coming next year, but I've heard he might not qualify so not counting my chickens yet.
The talent he is coaching is currently averaging 8 assists a game while turning it over on almost half of our trips down the court. We can't make free throws. This is all coachable with time which he has had.
The talent he is coaching is currently averaging 8 assists a game while turning it over on almost half of our trips down the court. We can't make free throws. This is all coachable with time which he has had.
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Posted on 2/22/15 at 9:58 am to Henry Jones Jr
I tried to read the OP but this thread has HIV so i got outta there
Posted on 2/22/15 at 10:06 am to DynastyDawg
quote:
Just can't tell Stansbury lovers that.
Shouldn't all State fans be Stansbury lovers? Seriously. Do you guys really have that much disdain for our most successful basketball coach in MSU history? Yeah, things imploded at the end but can we not have some perspective?
It's not that I'm even a Stansbury lover so to speak. I just look at it and say, we did well under him and I gave a shite about MSU basketball for my young adult life with him at the helm.
It's quite amazing the level of vitriol that some have towards him.
Posted on 2/22/15 at 11:04 am to sharpSee
I don't hate Stansbury.
Just because not all of us hold him higher in importance than our actual basketball program doesn't mean we hate him.
Just because not all of us hold him higher in importance than our actual basketball program doesn't mean we hate him.
Posted on 2/22/15 at 1:37 pm to DynastyDawg
quote:
Just because not all of us hold him higher in importance than our actual basketball program doesn't mean we hate him.
Being pissed that we have one of the worst basketball teams in any major conference doesn't mean people hold Stans above the program. Neither does acknowledging that he was a better coach than our current coach. I think Richard Williams was a better coach too, that doesn't mean I hold him above the program.
If anything, you people are the ones holding a coach above the program. We set a standard by firing Stans that as a program we weren't going to settle for mediocrity. Three years later you are betraying that standard by refusing to move past Ray based on the same criteria.
Posted on 2/22/15 at 6:09 pm to DynastyDawg
quote:
I don't hate Stansbury.
Ok fine. I'll give you that you don't hate Stans, but you said "It was" in response to Quicksilver saying "I didn't realize MSU basketball was that bad under Stans"...
That's what I can't compute. We were good for a sustained period of time. In fact, we were 3rd to just Florida and UK in SEC wins under Stans along with all of the other things we accomplished under Stans. Sure we didn't make a Sweet Sixteen, but that's fricking hard to do it and you need some luck. Hell Arky hasn't made a sweet 16 since 1996 and they are historically better hoops team than us.
My beef is when you or other State fans say we were bad under Stans. That's just flat out not true. Why can't we acknowledge that we were good under Stans? How hard is that haha
Posted on 2/22/15 at 6:10 pm to skirpnasty
quote:
I think Richard Williams was a better coach too
No doubt.
Posted on 2/23/15 at 1:35 am to sharpSee
Anyone remember Bundy's weekly power rankings?
Posted on 2/23/15 at 7:21 am to skirpnasty
quote:
If anything, you people are the ones holding a coach above the program.
lol wut
quote:
We set a standard by firing Stans that as a program we weren't going to settle for mediocrity
The majority of the reason Stansbury ended up not being the coach, or whatever you want to say ended up happening (fired, resigned, whatever), was because of what was going on off the court, not on it.
I mean it's pretty obvious we weren't a mediocre program when Stans was here. We underachieved a lot, maybe, but we still weren't mediocre.
Posted on 2/23/15 at 7:26 am to sharpSee
quote:
but you said "It was" in response to Quicksilver saying "I didn't realize MSU basketball was that bad under Stans"...
Yes I did. It was bad. Off the court. Not on it.
quote:
That's what I can't compute.
Striklin addressed a lot of the things that Ray has turned around within the program in a podcast with Bo Bounds last week, I would suggest everyone give it a listen. (He talks about more than just basketball as well) The graduation rates and player discipline that go into whatever that score is for the NCAA that each sport has to stay above. We were about to fall below that point total in Stansbury's last year, we may actually have I can't remember what he said. That was always my point against Stansbury. Underachieving was frustrating but not nearly as frustrating as the off the court issues.
quote:
My beef is when you or other State fans say we were bad under Stans. That's just flat out not true.
It was bad. Insanely bad. OFF the court. It most definitely is true.
quote:
Why can't we acknowledge that we were good under Stans?
I have many times. It is not difficult.
Posted on 2/23/15 at 7:30 am to sharpSee
I defend Ray, maybe to a fault, because it pissed me off from the moment he was hired there was almost no chance for him to succeed.
You cannot dispute the fact that the majority of the boosters and fans were pissed that we had parted ways with Stansbury (even when there was reason to do so) and did not, have not, and will not support the basketball program because of it. That is most definitely putting a coach above a program and that is the group of people I was referencing.
I want Ray to succeed purely to prove those people wrong and I hope they all are made to eat white dog shite when he does. I will concede that it doesn't look likely at this point, but I still hope like hell that he does.
You cannot dispute the fact that the majority of the boosters and fans were pissed that we had parted ways with Stansbury (even when there was reason to do so) and did not, have not, and will not support the basketball program because of it. That is most definitely putting a coach above a program and that is the group of people I was referencing.
I want Ray to succeed purely to prove those people wrong and I hope they all are made to eat white dog shite when he does. I will concede that it doesn't look likely at this point, but I still hope like hell that he does.
Posted on 2/23/15 at 8:19 am to DynastyDawg
Here here. 
Posted on 2/23/15 at 8:22 am to DynastyDawg
quote:6 NCAA Tournament appearances while never getting past the second round in 14 years is the definition of mediocrity.
I mean it's pretty obvious we weren't a mediocre program when Stans was here. We underachieved a lot, maybe, but we still weren't mediocre.
Posted on 2/23/15 at 8:38 am to MSUbulldogs03
That would be unacceptable at Kentucky
Posted on 2/23/15 at 8:47 am to SwayzeBalla
quote:No, not making a Final Four in 9 years gets you ran out of UK. Ask Tubby smith.
That would be unacceptable at Kentucky
Stans was doing less with more each year, and it was evident. Any respectable program would have looked elsewhere for a coach. Unfortunately, Stricklin looked at an assistant from a program historically worse than State.
Posted on 2/23/15 at 8:51 am to MSUbulldogs03
quote:
6 NCAA Tournament appearances while never getting past the second round in 14 years is the definition of mediocrity.
More SEC championships (outright, divisional, and tourney) than any team not named Kentucky over his last decade.
If you have problems with how we were off the court, that's understandable. Saying we weren't a good team on it is just silly though.
And that is the problem, people didn't sell it as firing him for off the court issues. They sold it as us not settling and getting someone to take us to the next level.
If you were in that crew, you have absolutely no reason to stand up for Ray at this point.
Now, I'm going to say something out of character. I hope like hell Ray pulls it together. I would love nothing more than him to be the second coming of coach K. At this point I just don't see it. I think we are probably better off hiring someone else and folding now. But again, I really hope he bucks the odds and I'm wrong.
This post was edited on 2/23/15 at 8:52 am
Posted on 2/23/15 at 9:01 am to skirpnasty
quote:3. He won 3. 2 tournaments and 1 regular season. And the 2009 SECt championship was lucky/just got hot at the right time.
More SEC championships (outright, divisional, and tourney) than any team not named Kentucky over his last decade.
Had Jamont not carried the team through that tournament, he doesn't even make the tournament that season.
quote:I was in that crew.
If you were in that crew,
quote:I'd love to bring someone new in.
you have absolutely no reason to stand up for Ray at this point.
This post was edited on 2/23/15 at 9:12 am
Posted on 2/23/15 at 9:33 am to MSUbulldogs03
quote:
I'd love to bring someone new in.
There you have it, Sticklin. MSUbulldogs03 says we need some fresh meat, you had best get on that.
Posted on 2/23/15 at 9:34 am to TaxmanMSU
Posted on 2/23/15 at 9:35 am to TaxmanMSU
quote:
There you have it, Sticklin. MSUbulldogs03 says we need some fresh meat, you had best get on that.
This thread is a closed case.
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