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Regarding MSU "touchdown" -- Rule 4-2-4-e
Posted on 9/10/11 at 3:34 pm
Posted on 9/10/11 at 3:34 pm
THE DEFINITION OF THE GOAL LINE:
"Goal Lines
ARTICLE 2. The goal line at each end of the field of play runs between the
sidelines and is part of the vertical plane that separates the end zone from
the field of play. This plane extends beyond the sidelines (Exception: Rule
4-2-4-e). The two goal lines are 100 yards apart. The entire goal line is in the
end zone. A team’s goal line is that which it is defending (A.R. 2-11-2-I)"
RULE 4-2-4-e
"Out of Bounds at Forward Point
ARTICLE 4. a. If a live ball is declared out of bounds and the ball does not
cross a boundary line, it is out of bounds at the ball’s most forward point
when it was declared dead (A.R. 4-2-4-I) (Exception: Rule 8-5-1-a, A.R.
8-5-1-I).
b. A touchdown may be scored if the ball is inbounds and has broken the
plane of the goal line before or simultaneous to the ball carrier going out
of bounds.
c. A receiver who is in the opponent’s end zone and contacting the ground
is credited with a completion if he reaches over the sideline or end line
and catches a legal pass.
d. The most forward point of the ball when declared out of bounds between
the end lines is the point of forward progress (A.R. 8-2-1-II and A.R.
8-5-1-X).
e. When a ball carrier dives or jumps toward the sideline and is airborne as
he crosses the sideline, forward progress is determined by the position
of the ball as it crosses the sideline (A.R. 8-2-1-III and IV)"
So based on the definition of "goal line" and Rule 4-2-4-e, the MSU player did not score because the ball went out of bounds before it crossed the goal line.
"Goal Lines
ARTICLE 2. The goal line at each end of the field of play runs between the
sidelines and is part of the vertical plane that separates the end zone from
the field of play. This plane extends beyond the sidelines (Exception: Rule
4-2-4-e). The two goal lines are 100 yards apart. The entire goal line is in the
end zone. A team’s goal line is that which it is defending (A.R. 2-11-2-I)"
RULE 4-2-4-e
"Out of Bounds at Forward Point
ARTICLE 4. a. If a live ball is declared out of bounds and the ball does not
cross a boundary line, it is out of bounds at the ball’s most forward point
when it was declared dead (A.R. 4-2-4-I) (Exception: Rule 8-5-1-a, A.R.
8-5-1-I).
b. A touchdown may be scored if the ball is inbounds and has broken the
plane of the goal line before or simultaneous to the ball carrier going out
of bounds.
c. A receiver who is in the opponent’s end zone and contacting the ground
is credited with a completion if he reaches over the sideline or end line
and catches a legal pass.
d. The most forward point of the ball when declared out of bounds between
the end lines is the point of forward progress (A.R. 8-2-1-II and A.R.
8-5-1-X).
e. When a ball carrier dives or jumps toward the sideline and is airborne as
he crosses the sideline, forward progress is determined by the position
of the ball as it crosses the sideline (A.R. 8-2-1-III and IV)"
So based on the definition of "goal line" and Rule 4-2-4-e, the MSU player did not score because the ball went out of bounds before it crossed the goal line.
Posted on 9/10/11 at 3:35 pm to Hog on the Hill
Boom?
I suck at reading
I suck at reading
Posted on 9/10/11 at 3:35 pm to flyAU
NOTE: This is from the 2009-2010 yearbook so that's the only caveat....
Posted on 9/10/11 at 3:36 pm to Hog on the Hill
Who is saying he did?
Posted on 9/10/11 at 3:38 pm to Diamondawg
Apparently the ref is, and that's what it looked like to me. I wasn't sure if it was a TD or not because I thought it was true that the goal line plane extends out of bounds, so I looked it up. The exception (rule 4-2-4-e) tells me it wasn't a touchdown.
edit: For the record, I was rooting for MSU
edit: For the record, I was rooting for MSU
This post was edited on 9/10/11 at 3:40 pm
Posted on 9/10/11 at 3:38 pm to Diamondawg
quote:
Who is saying he did?
Butthurt corndogs
Posted on 9/10/11 at 3:41 pm to joeyb147
I never thought it was a touchdown once I saw it in slow motion. He remained outside the pylon, so it was a good no call in my opinion.
Posted on 9/10/11 at 3:44 pm to Hog on the Hill
quote:
NOTE: This is from the 2009-2010 yearbook so that's the only caveat....
2009? You mean the LSU whiners claiming that they knew the rule pre-2011 were actually wrong to begin with?
Posted on 9/10/11 at 3:44 pm to Hog on the Hill
Merlins also could've had it reviewed.
Posted on 9/10/11 at 3:53 pm to jsmoove
Yeah I don't know what exactly changed in 2011... but this would still not have been a touchdown in 2009.
Posted on 9/10/11 at 4:00 pm to Hog on the Hill
If this rule was in place for 2010 then why would the NCAA make a specific rule change this year regarding this?
I think you missed this point in previous rule:
If a live ball is declared out of bounds and the ball does not
cross a boundary line
New rule put in keeps the goal line extending forever.. SO LONG as 1 of 2 events occur. The carrier touches pylon or endzone. So the ball could cross the sideline and still be a TD.
Based on your def of the rule the player could dive and have the ball cross the sideline and he could touch the pylon with his other hand and it wouldnt be a td. Thats not the case.
ETA: The new rule certainly simplifies the case.
I think you missed this point in previous rule:
If a live ball is declared out of bounds and the ball does not
cross a boundary line
New rule put in keeps the goal line extending forever.. SO LONG as 1 of 2 events occur. The carrier touches pylon or endzone. So the ball could cross the sideline and still be a TD.
Based on your def of the rule the player could dive and have the ball cross the sideline and he could touch the pylon with his other hand and it wouldnt be a td. Thats not the case.
ETA: The new rule certainly simplifies the case.
This post was edited on 9/10/11 at 4:03 pm
Posted on 9/10/11 at 5:36 pm to Catman88
quote:
Based on your def of the rule the player could dive and have the ball cross the sideline and he could touch the pylon with his other hand and it wouldnt be a td. Thats not the case.
This is true until you factor in the fact that an Auburn player with one foot in the end zone and one foot out of bounds touched the MSU player wile he was still in the air and past the goal line before any part of his body touched out of bounds. With the Auburn player connecting him to the end zone, the MSU ball carrier is down at that point with the goal line extended and the result of the play being a touchdown.
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