quote:
And never before has the Church issued a radical declaration of this nature about those living in a state of mortal sin: the language in Fiducia Supplicans is singularly focused on “irregular” relationships and thus shifts the focus away from the sinner and towards the sinful behavior itself.

Whether you acknowledge it or not, Fiducia Supplicans is a horrifically divisive document that has created tremendous division and scandal in the Church.

Right, so this is a different issue than the one I was responding to, which was:

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But by blessing a sinner who you know will continue to live in that sin (in this case homosexual marriage) are you, in effect, blessing the act as well as the sinner?

Exactly. And no amount of hermeneutical acrobatics, intellectual tightrope walking or other “clarifications” by Pope Francis or his sycophants changes that primary objection.

In fact, blessing a sinful person doesn't mean you bless the sin. That was my point, and it seems you agree.

To me, the larger issue here is that there are two issues at hand and they get blended together in the public forum. They are interconnected, but they are not the same.

First is the question of whether or not the document changes the Church's teaching regarding the invalidity or sinfulness of same-sex unions. It does not, yet this is what a lot of people think is happening.

The second is whether or not the document was ill-conceived and poorly worded. I actually agree with you that it was. I actually mostly agree with what Muller says in your post. I think it should have been obvious from the start that it would cause confusion. Cardinal Sarah recently said something like, "The greatest mercy you can show someone is the truth." I agree with Cardinal Sarah here too. I do dislike Francis's apparent hesitation to say things clearly because they might hurt someone's feelings.

But thinking the document was a disaster is very different from thinking the Pope has changed Church teaching that homosexuality is a sin, which many people think he has. Heck, he cited the 2021 document that clearly calls it a sin in Fiducia Supplicans.

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Posted by Toomer Deplorable

Team Bitter Clinger

Member since May 2020

17986 posts

Posted on 2/12/24 at 1:33 pm to CatholicLSUDude

quote:
But thinking the document was a disaster is very different from thinking the Pope has changed Church teaching that homosexuality is a sin, which many people think he has.

You are far more generous in your assessment of this Jesuit Pope’s agenda than I.

I myself once gave him the benefit of the doubt and argued that though his personal inclination was to present matters of faith in shades of gray, I took him at his word that his goal was simply to make sure the Church door was opened to all:

Pope Francis Apologizes That Amazon Synod ‘Pachamama’ Was Thrown Into Tiber River

Yet Pope Francis’ continual reliance upon solipsistic casuistry to defend his sloppily-worded pronouncements and his equivocal statements on questions of morality and faith led me to question if he harbored ulterior motives beyond mere inclusion.

More importantly, his vindictive spirit when addressing criticism of the ambiguity that is inherent to his statements has brought me to a different and more malicious conclusion.

Ambiguous words lend themselves to different interpretations and conclusions depending upon who is reading them and this thus opens the door to moral relevancy, which is diametrically opposed to Christ-like inclusion.

As Cardinal Müller indicates, when it comes to matters of mortal sin, we have no choice as faithful Catholics but to unequivocally proclaim the Catechism in bold and primary colors:

….I think with all these interviews and interpretations of the interpretation of interpretations, things are not getting better. Go back to the clarity of the word of God, and what is said in the Catechism, and not this bowing down to this absolutely wrong LGBT and woke ideology. That is not modern; that is a falling back to the old paganism.

This post was edited on 2/12/24 at 4:37 pm

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