NC State vs FSU. This, in a nutshell, is what concerns some UA fans

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There is this narrative that FSU's defense is so damn good that we didn't have time to pass the ball

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I mean, I don't know if that's because FSU's defense was so damn good, but we did not have time to throw the ball much. Watch the replay again if you don't believe that. Could we have schemed that a little better? Sure, but we didn't First game with no tape? Not sure about the offensive system and what our guys could do? Offensive line figuring things out? Maybe all of those, but the biggest issue against FSU was 100% pass protection/route selection.

Also - if you watched the NCSU-FSU game (I did, 90% of it), you will note that NC State's greatest success was quick throws to the flat and into space (which you noted, areas vacated by linebackers). Finley probably completed 1 ball deep down the field all day.

Of NC State's 230 yards, 85 of them came on 2 plays. A shovel pass to Samuels (a slot WR/RB who had 12 catches for 64 yards) for 14 yards and a 71 yard TD pass to a receiver that was a short throw (roughly 9 yards in the air) in which the DB dove for the break up and missed and then the WR juked Derwin James out of his shoes and went the distance.

So, 2 short easy throws that took advantage of FSU overplaying things. Outside of that, Finley was 20/30 for 145 yards (4.8 YPA). NC State's entire gameplan was throwing the ball into short zones across the middle and in the flats and FSU flat out missed tackles and overran things (things they did not do against us, I might add, why I don't know - that's a different discussion). Personally, I think we have opened things up quite a bit since then and am happy with the progress of the playcalling and offensive scheme. I was not thrilled after the FSU game. It felt like we left a lot of opportunities out there in terms of offensive game management by the coordinator. I have liked some of the stuff we have done since, though.

Let's put it this way, if Hurts had those numbers with the throws Finley made we'd be saying Hurts still can't throw the ball down the field.

FSU was probably bring the house against Bama, since they didn't respect the passing game.

Huddie Ledbetter posts cause cancer

Losing their starting QB has demoralized FSU, who did not play with the same intensity against NC State as they did against Bama. Being off for an extended period of time only exacerbated this issue.

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Can we please just have honest discussions about these things?

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But there are all those qualifications.

But we didn't need to pass the ball to beat them.

But receivers dropped the ball.

But Tua came in when they were beat (as if that was the very instant they gave up)

But NC State's best pass plays were short passes and long runs.

But their scheme was better.

But our line wasn't ready the first game.

But so much of this that and the other thing rather than the fact that our passing game is not very good and can get better. Some folks don't want an honest discussion about that.

edit: And I'm not faulting you. You seem pretty reasonable about the facts. Some people are not so much.

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But NC State's best pass plays were short passes and long runs.

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But their scheme was better.

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I don't know why this is a qualification. It's literally what happened in the football game. They threw short passes and broke one of them. I also don't know if the concern noted was with Daboll or Hurts. If it was Daboll, I generally agree based only on the FSU game. NC State looked like they had a much better offensive plan for beating FSU. If the concern was with Jalen.........I mean I'm generally open to most of the criticism of him but completing 6 yard routes is something I think we all agree he is competent at. I don't think the FSU game was a very good game for us offensively all around. I "think" we have improved (mainly on the O-line and playcalling), but we won't know for sure until we play LSU probably, and maybe not until Auburn (which is indicative of what a terrible league the SEC is this year).

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But our line wasn't ready the first game.

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I have no idea if our line was "ready" or what the excuse was for how they played. I do know that they got their arse beat. Those are facts.

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But so much of this that and the other thing rather than the fact that our passing game is not very good and can get better. Some folks don't want an honest discussion about that.

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My point is I'm tired of people thinking they have to shade things to make a point that the other side is shading things. There are clear examples that Jalen still has issues throwing the football. Not seeing open routes is the biggest. I think NC State running a Jalen friendly gameplan against FSU and succeeding is more of a mark against Daboll than it is Jalen.

NC State basically ran the gameplan we all complain about with Jalen. Throw 90% routes under 12 yards. They broke one of those short throws for 80 yards, which was good for them. Outside of that they averaged about 5 YPA.

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NC State basically ran the gameplan we all complain about with Jalen

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But Jalen is either afraid to pull the trigger and/or still can't check down to secondary receivers, so he takes off, or the coaches don't have confidence in him doing it and advise him to bail. Either case is pretty disconcerting and isn't good for the development of a balanced offense. We had a balanced offense with Jake freakin Coker.

Maybe it will improve.

I gotta go work some.

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Maybe it will improve.

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I honestly doubt it at this point. I think it is what it is.

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I gotta go work some.

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Same