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How many EEs can be counted back to the previous year's class?

Posted on 7/30/14 at 6:15 pm
Posted by Cockopotamus
Member since Jan 2013
15737 posts
Posted on 7/30/14 at 6:15 pm
Is it a hard cap at 5? Or does it just depend on how many spaces are available?

For example, if a school signed 17 players out of the 25 allowed in 2014, could they count back 8 EE from the 2015 class or just 5?
Posted by Weagle25
THE Football State.
Member since Oct 2011
46175 posts
Posted on 7/30/14 at 6:31 pm to
Depends on how many you signed the year before I believe
Posted by Garfield
Kew Gardens
Member since Dec 2011
7785 posts
Posted on 7/30/14 at 7:14 pm to
I don't think it's a hard cap. UT back counted a really big group last year.

I know Bama has at times back counted more than the usual amount by retroactively revoking scholarships after the season was over and making the kids pay back the tuition money. Not sure if anyone else does this.
Posted by SoGaFan
Member since Jan 2008
5956 posts
Posted on 7/30/14 at 7:30 pm to
It isn't a hard cap. your entire class can be EEs, technically, they just all wouldn't count back. I do think you have to have the room under the 85 though as well. I could be wrong about that, though.
Posted by MID_TN_VOL
Franklin,TN
Member since Sep 2013
592 posts
Posted on 7/30/14 at 8:12 pm to
Yep had 14 EEs last class.
Posted by Cockopotamus
Member since Jan 2013
15737 posts
Posted on 7/30/14 at 8:23 pm to
quote:

Yep had 14 EEs last class.



And they all counted back?
Posted by MID_TN_VOL
Franklin,TN
Member since Sep 2013
592 posts
Posted on 7/30/14 at 8:33 pm to
6 were back counted
Posted by CockInYourEar
Charlotte
Member since Sep 2012
22458 posts
Posted on 7/30/14 at 8:37 pm to
quote:

And they all counted back?


If found the answer to that original question.

https://www.catalogsgate.com/gamerules/2014_NCAA_Division_Manual/files/assets/basic-html/page221.html

You can have as many as you want count back to the previous year as long as the guys you had and the number you want to count back, doesn't exceed 85. There is not a limit of only 5 Early Enrollees counting back that is mentioned in the bylaws that I saw.

Last year, tenn found a loophole about getting people to sign financial aid documents early, before Dec 1. This allowed them to have unlimited contact with those recruits and double dip on counting back scholarships. They will be at 85 scholarships for this season, but they had to do a bunch of processing b/w Dec and now.

Posted by Nicolae
Member since Dec 2012
1880 posts
Posted on 7/30/14 at 10:32 pm to
quote:

Is it a hard cap at 5? Or does it just depend on how many spaces are available?



No hard cap. If you had a class in which you took nobody, then you could take 50 in the next class. Just as long as 25 of them were EEs and everyone fit under the 85-man cap when the season rolls around.
This post was edited on 7/30/14 at 10:33 pm
Posted by CGSC Lobotomy
Member since Sep 2011
79954 posts
Posted on 7/30/14 at 10:44 pm to
I'll answer by using A&M's classes as an example.

Mike Sherman signed 21 players in the 2011 class to Letters of Intent. That allows 4 from the 2012 class to count towards the 2011 class.

Ignoring the number of early enrollees in that class for purposes of explanation, that would allow you to count back 4 players from the 2012 class towards the 2011 class.

Kevin Sumlin signed 19 players in the 2012 class. Of those, Matt Davis, Derel Walker, Kenneth Marshall, and Tramaine Jacobs enrolled early, leaving 15 that actually count towards 2012.

Kevin Sumlin signed 31 players in the 2013 class. Of those 31 players, 8 players enrolled early, leaving 23 towards the 2013 class.

Sumlin signed 21 players in the 2014 class. While 7 enrolled early, only 2 counted towards the 2013 class, with 19 counting towards the 2014 class.

Basically, if the scholarships are available, A&M could theoretically sign 31 in 2015. It's likely we will sign 25 or 26 at most, with Evans, Davis, Murray, Mack, and at least 2 more enrolling early. This would leave between 5-6 we could count back towards 2015 with the 2016 class.



This post was edited on 7/31/14 at 12:17 pm
Posted by Patton
Principality of Sealand
Member since Apr 2011
32647 posts
Posted on 7/30/14 at 10:51 pm to
quote:

I know Bama has at times back counted more than the usual amount by retroactively revoking scholarships after the season was over and making the kids pay back the tuition money. Not sure if anyone else does this.


you are the man
Posted by ConwayGamecock
South Carolina
Member since Jan 2012
9121 posts
Posted on 7/31/14 at 4:36 am to
quote:

6 were back counted


Yep, Tennessee had a 2014 class of 31 commits: 25 + 6 extra that counted back, but 14 early-enrollees all told...

UT got a lot of grief over that class, but UGA had an even bigger class the cycle before that one: they brought in a 33-man class for 2013.

Although I don't think they all got in, but in 2012 UGA had a small class of 19 due to some NSD targets they expected to sign with them instead choosing to go elsewhere. UGA had 2-3 from that class not pass admissions, then had 1-2 that counted back to the 2011 class.

So ultimately UGA's 2012 class counted 15 towards the 25 max they were allowed to bring in. That's why their 2013 class was so big: they could technically back-count 10 to 2012 if they had enough to enroll early. As it was, they only had 8 EEs, but they counted all of them back. So there's really no limit.

USC is dealing more with it's 85-scholarship limit than with how many EEs it can bring in. Technically USC's 2014 class will number 14: 21 initially, Abu Lamin counted back to 2013; and 6 failed to pass admissions.

So 14 out of 25 means USC could technically count back 11 in our 2015 class if we had 11 EEs. And bring in a 36-man class for 2015. But if we did that we'd go well over our 85-scholarship limit.

As it is, there'll have to be some attrition of early departures of juniors (Mike Davis, Brandon Shell, Shaq Roland perhaps) plus maybe several 4th-yr. juniors that haven't contributed, transferring out for better playing opportunities (they should already have earned their degrees - We have quite a number of those), in order for this 2015 class to go much over 25 commits (we're already at that number). We'll bring in upwards of 30 I'm sure....
Posted by Aggball
Houston
Member since Jun 2014
640 posts
Posted on 7/31/14 at 6:38 am to
quote:

I'll answer by using A&M's classes as an example. Mike Sherman signed 21 players in the 2011 class to Letters of Intent. That allows 4 from the 2012 class to count towards the 2011 class. Ignoring the number of early enrollees in that class for purposes of explanation, that would allow you to count back 4 players from the 2012 class towards the 2011 class. Kevin Sumlin signed 19 players in the 2012 class. Of those, Matt Davis, Derel Walker, Kenneth Marshall, and Tramaine Jacobs enrolled early, leaving 15 that actually count towards 2012. Kevin Sumlin signed 31 players in the 2013 class. Of those 32 players, 8 players enrolled early, leaving 23 towards the 2013 class. Sumlin signed 21 players in the 2014 class. While 7 enrolled early, only 2 counted towards the 2013 class, with 19 counting towards the 2014 class. Basically, if the scholarships are available, A&M could theoretically sign 31 in 2015. It's likely we will sign 25 or 26 at most, with Evans, Davis, Murray, Mack, and at least 2 more enrolling early. This would leave between 5-6 we could count back towards 2015 with the 2016 class.


Thank you for going through the trouble of getting all this data. I knew the answer to the OP but awesome job presenting the info for our recent classes.

Appreciate it.
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